read new nonstop follow 88496 9-JUL 19:47 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88495) From: JRUPPEL To: GLOCKR Well, my friend, if you are interested in some exotic home brewed hardware, you are in the right place ;) Check the forum here and the Coco SIG. Take a look at the Hardware Dat at the coco sig and the Gen and OSK Dat's here. It'll give you a lot of insight. Many folks here have hardware and info available... I'm sure that they will drop you a line... John Ruppel CocoNuts in Lansing -*- 88497 9-JUL 20:34 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88495) From: RANDYKWILSON To: GLOCKR Ken, You,ve found the right Sig. Lots of Motorola spoken here. The majority of the machines used/talked about in this sig are: Tandy Color Computer 3 (coco) with a 6809 or Hitachi 6309 MM1 (68070 and 68340) contact NIMITZ PT68/Delmar (680x0) contact EDELMAR FHL/Hazelwood (680x0) contact FHOGG The first machine is no longer made, but plentiful used. The last three are all in production (last two having multiple models), and come in "kit" form. ere, kit form means you get the populated boards and maybe a case/keyboard; much like piecing together a PClone. If by kit you mean a few boards and a baggie full of chips... well, I think those days are pretty much gone. Maybe someone like GMX still has such to offer. But it's doubtful. All of the machines run a version of OS-9, obviously. The PT machines (maybe FHL as well) do have alternate operating systems. If you have questions on the specifics of the machines, send email to the vendor reps I listed. Randy -*- 88501 9-JUL 23:36 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88495) From: COCOKIWI To: GLOCKR there was a 680000 kit put out a long time ago, it,s clone is the DELMAR machine....but is not a kit,The ORG 68000 kit upgraded but the board is around! I don,t know the maker,so keep looking! Peter Stark was the one whom made the ORG 68000 system the idea was a 68000 board that used STANDARD AT style Dennis -*- 88508 10-JUL 11:18 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88501) From: WRHAMBLEN To: COCOKIWI Dennis, Fred Brown (Peripheral Techonology & Computer Design) designed the PT68K-2 that was described in the articles that Peter Stark wrote for Radio Electronics in 1987/88. PT also manufactured peripheral boards for the SwTPC system (6800 and 6809) and single board 6809 and 68008 systems. It was Peter's idea to put XT-compatible I/O slots on the PT68K-2. Peter supplied the HUMBUG ROM monitor and the SK*DOS operating system. PT later supplied Dan Farnsworth's MONK ROM monitor and REX operating system (not as nice as HUMBUG & SK*DOS, in my opinion). Fred and Peter later had a parting of the ways. Bud -*- 88512 10-JUL 13:21 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88496) From: GLOCKR To: JRUPPEL John, thanks for the info. I'm looking forward to building a non-IBM clone -*- 88513 10-JUL 13:33 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88497) From: GLOCKR To: RANDYKWILSON Thanks for the info on the OS9 machines. -*- 88514 10-JUL 13:35 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88501) From: GLOCKR To: COCOKIWI Thanks for the info:) -*- 88532 11-JUL 02:29 General Information RE: home-brewing (Re: Msg 88508) From: COCOKIWI To: WRHAMBLEN I figured someone would full in the gaps .....Thanks for that! Dennis -*- End of Thread. -*- 88498 9-JUL 21:17 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88458) From: TEDJAEGER To: JOELHEGBERG > I don't know if this is needed or not, but I had to also reference the > usr.l library in the l68 step, so it would be: > r68 sysgo.a -O=sysgo.r > l68 sysgo.r -O=sysgo -l=/dd/lib/usr.l -l=/dd/lib/sys.l Joel, I found that the following: l68 sysgo.r -l=/dd/lib/sys.l -o=sysgo works to compile sysgo.a fine. Linking both usr.l and sys.l also works and produces an identical sysgo.r. However, l68 sysgo.r -l=/dd/lib/usr.l -o=sysgo leaves an unresolved error (TotRAM I think it was.) BUT, there are some mysteries re the sysgo.a file! Notice that on the first page of the source there is an OptTime label at the beginning of a line that supposedly gives the user an option to have or not have the time displayed in the startup message. That option is not set in the source but I got the time displayed anyway. Didnt want it because it wraps around to the next line on my startup screen, looking kinda ugly! Anyway, I started looking through the source and there are no lines like: ifne OptTime ... ... endc that would seem to allow for conditional assembly of the display time option. Another oddity I noticed was that after installing sysgo version 9 my system tried to boot entirely from floppy. I had been using version 5 of sysgo and with it the os9boot was read from floppy but .login and startup from HD. My init had /d0 set so I dont know how it managed to go to HD but it did. Anyway, I changed /d0 to /dd in init and then the new sysgo booted as did version 5 but still with the time displayed. Could you pass along what modifications to make to sysgo.a to get the conditional assembly of the time display? Bests ---TedJaeger -*- 88500 9-JUL 23:34 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88498) From: MITHELEN To: TEDJAEGER Yep.. you seem to be right... the conditionals for OptTime seem to have been left out.... You can "fix" you code by putting in a: ifne OptTime before the block of code that has the comment "Print time of boot..." and an: endc before the "SayWhat" label... I'm not a assembly programmer, nor do I play one on TV, bnut this looks like it will do the trick... -- Paul -*- 88521 10-JUL 17:42 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88498) From: TIMKIENTZLE To: TEDJAEGER Sorry about leaving off the OptTime conditionals. Paul has exactly the right points for putting those in. This sysgo is different from the sysgo distributed with OS9/68k. As you can tell from the comments, it's had a number of different folks beating on it, and I pretty thoroughly rearranged a lot of stuff. If you dump the old sysgo, you'll notice it has a reference to /DD hardwired into it (look near the very end), which the version I uploaded here lacks. (On the rationale that it should follow Init.) - Tim -*- 88535 11-JUL 07:51 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88521) From: JOELHEGBERG To: TIMKIENTZLE (NR) Tim, > This sysgo is different from the sysgo distributed with OS9/68k. As > you can tell from the comments, it's had a number of different folks > beating on it, and I pretty thoroughly rearranged a lot of stuff. And may I say, you did an excellent job in cleaning up the source and arranging its storage in a logical order. That helped a lot when I decided to modify the code. ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88536 11-JUL 07:51 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88498) From: JOELHEGBERG To: TEDJAEGER Ted, > Joel, I found that the following: > l68 sysgo.r -l=/dd/lib/sys.l -o=sysgo > works to compile sysgo.a fine. Linking both usr.l and sys.l also works > and produces an identical sysgo.r. However, > l68 sysgo.r -l=/dd/lib/usr.l -o=sysgo > leaves an unresolved error (TotRAM I think it was.) Cool, I _thought_ that was what should happen... glad you tried it! > Another oddity I noticed was that after installing sysgo version 9 > my system tried to boot entirely from floppy. I had been using version > 5 of sysgo and with it the os9boot was read from floppy but .login and > startup from HD. That's where I think I've always kept my .login and startup file(s). It boots faster if it can get those off the HD. ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88566 12-JUL 22:54 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88500) From: TEDJAEGER To: MITHELEN Thanks for the info. I will give it a try & let you know. Bests ---TedJaeger -*- 88567 12-JUL 22:54 General Information RE: sysgo.a compile (Re: Msg 88521) From: TEDJAEGER To: TIMKIENTZLE (NR) No apology needed! In fact, thanks for working to improve the MM1. Bests ---TedJaeger -*- End of Thread. -*- 88499 9-JUL 23:28 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88485) From: COCOKIWI To: KSCALES NO sooner than you get this one configured,......Put a BIG.chain and lock on it,with ARMED guards!........ Dennis -*- 88517 10-JUL 16:07 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88491) From: HAWKSOFT To: DBREEDING Hi Dave! > > This is some SERIOUS software!!!!!!!!!! > > You better believe it. I've had my system (a System 5) for about a > month, haven't even scratched the surface yet. Just recently played > around with the auto-ex capabilities. Truly awesome. For example, > if you click on a makefile... she'll do the make, automatically. > > I think G-Windows is the way to go to give us a truly universal > platform to work from. Hopefully, enough MM/1 owners will get into > it to become a standard for you guys. I heartily agree! I was so impressed with the auto-ex that I wrote a sound file player for G-Windows and a file recognizer. G-Windows automatically shows my custom icon for the sound files and plays them with just a double- click! I recently had an inquiry from a fellow that wrote a driver for the System 5's DAC regarding the MM/1 system calls, so he could make his calls compatible with our existing programs. That would make porting our sound programs to you a snap!! (Sent with InfoXpress running under G-Widows!) Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88523 10-JUL 19:19 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88494) From: DBREEDING To: NIMITZ > Actually, David, the ability to click on an Icon and get make to > autoexecute is already there on the MM/1 Desktop. I figured it probably could; I was just amazed at how complete it seemed. I'm still standing in amazement at these OSK machines. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88524 10-JUL 19:20 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88517) From: DBREEDING To: HAWKSOFT > > I think G-Windows is the way to go to give us a truly universal > > platform to work from. Hopefully, enough MM/1 owners will get into > > it to become a standard for you guys. > > I heartily agree! I was so impressed with the auto-ex that I wrote a > sound file player for G-Windows and a file recognizer. G-Windows > I recently had an inquiry from a fellow that wrote a > driver for the System 5's DAC regarding the MM/1 system calls, so he could > make his calls compatible with our existing programs. That would make > porting our sound programs to you a snap!! That's just what I would love to see. I think that if we can get it so you can write an advanced windowing program that will work for all 3 systems, then that would give more incentive to write. When/if your sound player gets available for the Sys 5, I, for one will be interested. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88534 11-JUL 07:51 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88485) From: JOELHEGBERG To: KSCALES Ken, > I just returned from a two-day business trip, and found three boxes had > been dumped next to my desk at work. Guess I will spend next week ... > this new machine. It's a 7100... Excellent... you'll really like how it works! I've enjoyed mine. And it doesn't have one of those nasty intel chips in it. ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88564 12-JUL 22:39 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88524) From: HAWKSOFT To: DBREEDING Hi Dave! > That's just what I would love to see. I think that if we can get it so > you can write an advanced windowing program that will work for all 3 > systems, then that would give more incentive to write. When/if your sound > player gets available for the Sys 5, I, for one will be interested. Well, that's one! There IS an advanced windowing system that will work on all 3 systems (and many more besides!). That's why I bought G-Windows. Now if we could have the ability to switch back and forth from K- to G- ! Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88654 16-JUL 13:34 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88564) From: DBREEDING To: HAWKSOFT > There IS an advanced windowing system that will work on all 3 systems > (and many more besides!). That's why I bought G-Windows. Now if we could > have the ability to switch back and forth from K- to G- ! Yes, I am harboring hopes that G-Windows might be the tie that binds. I would love to see K-Windows available for us, too, but I fear that this may not be. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88724 20-JUL 20:26 General Information RE: OS-9 Live! (Re: Msg 88654) From: HAWKSOFT To: DBREEDING David: > > There IS an advanced windowing system that will work on all 3 systems > > (and many more besides!). That's why I bought G-Windows. Now if we > could > have the ability to switch back and forth from K- to G- ! > > Yes, I am harboring hopes that G-Windows might be the tie that binds. I'm afraid that G-W would be too expensive to include as part of the MM/1 hardware (or Kix or SysIV/V). > I would love to see K-Windows available for us, too, but I fear that > this may not be. Well, IF you're a programmer and very ambitious contact David Graham. I know that the source for windio is NOT available to the public, but, the MM/1 port of G-Windows (as I undestand) was done by an MM/1 owner without the source. After all the hardware is supposed to be similar. Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- End of Thread. -*- 88503 10-JUL 05:43 Programmers Den RE: OS9000 (Re: Msg 88463) From: EDELMAR To: COLORSYSTEMS Zack, The name of the driver is 'pcpll'. I doubt you'll find a 68230 used on a MSDOS machine. They use an Intel chip - forget the number. Ed -*- 88510 10-JUL 12:23 Programmers Den RE: OS9000 (Re: Msg 88503) From: COLORSYSTEMS To: EDELMAR > The name of the driver is 'pcpll'. I doubt you'll find a 68230 used > on a MSDOS machine. They use an Intel chip - forget the number. OPPS!! I forgot we were talking OS9K!! Thanks for the correction! ------------------------------------ Zack C Sessions They say, "Money talks". But all mine ever says is, "Goodbye". -*- End of Thread. -*- 88504 10-JUL 09:42 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88400) From: MRGOOD To: NIMITZ I have a 360K floppy in my MM! that I have never managed to get working. I tried all sorts of descriptors, track configurations with nop results. The floppy tested out OK on my old coco. Hugo -*- 88509 10-JUL 12:05 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88504) From: MITHELEN To: MRGOOD Heres the dmode setting's on my 360K floppy on my MM/1... have had no problems with it. name=c2 drv=2 stp=3 typ=$24 dns=$01 cyl=40 sid=2 vfy=0 (on) sct=18 t0s=18 sas=8 ilv=2 tfm=0 toffs=0 soffs=1 ssize=256 cntl=$0000 trys=0 lun=0 wpc=0 rwr=0 park=0 lsnoffs=0 totcyls=80 ctrlrid=0 rates=$10 scsiopt=$0000 maxcount=65535 and the floppy driver ident is: Header for: rb37c65 Module size: $BE8 #3048 Owner: 0.2 Module CRC: $400E67 Good CRC Header parity: $1E66 Good parity Edition: $6 #6 Ty/La At/Rev $E01 $A000 Permission: $555 -----e-r-e-r-e-r Dev Drv, 68000 obj, Sharable, System State Process -- Paul -*- 88511 10-JUL 12:23 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88509) From: COLORSYSTEMS To: MITHELEN Can you format a blamk floppy on it for the CoCo and then take the disk to a CoCo and read it? ------------------------------------ Zack C Sessions They say, "Money talks". But all mine ever says is, "Goodbye". -*- 88528 10-JUL 21:53 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88504) From: NIMITZ To: MRGOOD I'll see what I can do for you, going to have to pack up the I/O board soon, switching it back out with a person I loaned my own to to aide some sound software development, so I'll be without for a week or two. David -*- 88529 11-JUL 01:13 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88511) From: MITHELEN To: COLORSYSTEMS I'm pretty sure I have, although I can't say for sure. I know I have read disks that were created on a CoCo though... -- Paul -*- 88538 11-JUL 19:29 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88529) From: COLORSYSTEMS To: MITHELEN > I'm pretty sure I have, although I can't say for sure. I know I have read > disks that were created on a CoCo though... Yes, I can read and write to CoCo formatted floppies *as long as they were formatted on a real CoCo*. I can read and write to floppies I format on the MM/1a, but I can't read them on a CoCo. Here is a dmode of my /c1 device which physically is a 5.25" 360K 40track DSDD floppy: name=c1 drv=1 stp=3 typ=$20 dns=$01 cyl=40 sid=2 vfy=0 (on) sct=18 t0s=18 sas=8 ilv=2 tfm=0 toffs=0 soffs=1 ssize=256 cntl=$0000 trys=0 lun=0 wpc=0 rwr=0 park=0 lsnoffs=0 totcyls=40 ctrlrid=0 rates=$10 scsiopt=$0000 maxcount=65535 ------------------------------------ Zack C Sessions They say, "Money talks". But all mine ever says is, "Goodbye". -*- 88543 11-JUL 22:59 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88509) From: MRGOOD To: MITHELEN No matter what dmode settings I use, all I get is an error 246. The light comes on, the drive spins, but nothing happens otherwise. Hugo PS. I tested 2 drives known to be good with the same results. -*- 88545 12-JUL 01:16 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88543) From: NIMITZ To: MRGOOD Hugo, check the settings of the RY line on that drive. David -*- 88546 12-JUL 02:01 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88538) From: MITHELEN To: COLORSYSTEMS Hmm.. Ok.. I'll format a floppy this week, and bring it to the Glenside meeting this Thurs and see if it is readable on a CoCo (I don't have a coco of my own to test it on) -*- 88609 14-JUL 21:53 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88545) From: MRGOOD To: NIMITZ What's the RY line? Is it a jumper on the drive or a wire on the cable? Hugo -*- 88651 16-JUL 12:11 OSK Applications RE: MM/1 5 1/4 Drive for CoCo Format (Re: Msg 88609) From: NIMITZ To: MRGOOD The RY line that burned up was the wire on teh cable. David -*- End of Thread. -*- 88505 10-JUL 10:04 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88202) From: CBJ To: DBREEDING RE: your comment on support for PC's I own three PC's and have built several systems for others. Your comment on support was about as off base as most comments I see when people in this SIG start a discussion on PC's. I've never had anything but good support from the PC vendors I use. I've heard horror stories about some OS-K machine vendors (I will NOT list vendor names in an open forum). I have been involved in making OSK machines work for some time now and also use PC's on a regular basis. Support is directly related to the vendor that you buy from. If you buy a PC clone from Wal-Mart you can expect support that is lousy. If you buy the same type of computer from a PC marketter (a person that makes his living from building and selling systems) you will get better support. If you buy a computer from COMP USA (a store that sells only computers, software and related hardware) you will get excellent support. Where does the Rat Shack fall into the equation? Somewhere in between Wal-Mart and COMP USA. Why? Because they sell more than just computer related products. With such a wide assortment of products the personal can not be trained to be computer specialists. It isn't cost effective. Of course you can always luck out and find a Radio Shack that has knowledgeable people but it usually isn't due to training that they received from Radio Shack (ex-computer center or outlet employees are the exceptions to this rule as are some managers). So..... If you want good support look for it before you buy. Buy wisely. Carl -*- 88506 10-JUL 10:36 General Information RE: Chico fest (Re: Msg 87919) From: CBJ To: MRUPGRADE Terry, You've made many comments here in this thread that I need to comment on. First, attendance at the CoCoFest was actually a little higher than last year for show attendees. We had three fewer vendors (actually only one fewer if you discount the one time attendance of M'Ware and the International OS-9 User Groups. All in all it was an excellent turn out. So good that we have already reserved the Holiday Inn for next year. We need to work on the seminars (plans are already being discussed) and we want to try to lower the prices again (we are looking at that area as well). It would be nice if we could do it all for free but reality strikes again. As far as OSK programs, etc. OSK has much more available than OS-9/6809 does. The programs that are available are better in most cases and thus cost more. Because OSK is has fewer memory limitations due to inherently more powerful processors it is much easier to port utilities from the UNIX world over to the OSK machines as well. ELM is an excellent example. You complain about the acronyms being cryptic...well, so is homepac. Why do I need a program to help me pack up my home? A lot of the utilities mentioned are well known in the UNIX area under the names mentioned. DYNACALC...A calculator program? There can only be so many descriptive names. Feel free to name any program something else when you use it or do what I do, write a startup script and name that something you like. I will also comment generally about the number of new programs available for the CoCo as opposed to OSK machines at the show. I'd say it was closer to 50/50. Northern Xposure had a lot of new 68(3)09 stuff and I saw other new stuff for the CoCo. Unfortunately a few of the older CoCo vendors didn't have anything new for the CoCo but have turned their creative talents to OSK pretty much exclusively. I can only remember two items that were new for RS-DOS. That is a shame but to be expected. The same goes for OS-9 6809, it will continue to lose the programmers as they look for more power to write bigger and better programs. If you were in the PC area you'd realize that this is exactly what is happennin there as well. You almost have to have a '386 with VGA to run any new applications. Games aren't even being written without sound-blaster support and VGA is a must as is extended/expanded memory. So much for the old original IBM PC users. The same thing has happened to the original MAC users, AMIGA users, etc. This is called progress. While we can lament the loss of our excellent programmers we must be realistic about it as well. This trend will continue. It isn't only about money either. Money is frequently used as an excuse because it is something that everybody can understand. After talking with quite a few programmers that have moved away from the CoCo I find that while they say that they moved away because the market is dying when questioned in greater detail they actually moved on because the CoCo doesn't allow them the freedom to build the large programs that intrigue them. These are creative people and they feel that their creativity is stifled by the CoCo/OS-9 6809 and the limitations of the 6809(6309). I can't blame them. It is also their choice. All in all they are still willing to help others that haven't moved on by answerring questions and providing examples on how to work around the limitations that the 6809 imposes...they just don't want to do it themselves any more. Carl -*- 88507 10-JUL 10:43 General Information RE: Chico fest (Re: Msg 88506) From: MRUPGRADE To: CBJ Excellant Carl. My comments were from clips I'd heard here and there. It evidently evoked a very nice and complete (I might add well writen) response. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- 88525 10-JUL 19:22 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88505) From: DBREEDING To: CBJ > RE: your comment on support for PC's > > I own three PC's and have built several systems for others. Your comment > on support was about as off base as most comments I see when people in > this SIG start a discussion on PC's. I've never had anything but good I was only addressing the fact that so many people think that if you don't own a PC, you don't have a computer. To begin with, I wouldn't even consider recommending an OS9 machine to a computer illiterate person. However, this same person, however, is bound to have difficulty with any computer he/she buys. In my case, I spent a very, very great deal of time trying to decide on whether to go to an OSK system, get a PC, or a Mac. In the end, I went with OSK, fully realizing I can't go into Wal-Mart and see rows of software for my system. One thing that did influence me was what I referred to in msg 88202. On the BBS's these guys often had to go in and juggle their interrupts around and whatever to install an internal modem. What I was referring to was the fact that you can't plop even a PC down and expect it to do it all itself. RE: support, in an earlier message, I referred to a friend's experience with customer support. This is only one case, but a true case, nonetheless. I recently read an article in a PC magazine, or maybe Computer Shopper, regarding customer support. According to him, the Gateway forum in CIS was filled with complaints in this regard. What I was referring to in my latest msg was the fact that should I have a problem, I did have a few questions, or if a customer of Dave Graham or Frank Hogg has a problem, you will be able to get in touch with one of them personally, not a sales rep, and while they might not be on top of this particular problem, I expect that they will be knowledgeable enough to find an answer. No, the PC is a good computer, and probably the best choice for the true _user_. But I think my OS is every bit the equal, to say the least. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88558 12-JUL 21:47 General Information RE: Chico fest (Re: Msg 88506) From: CPERRAULT To: CBJ >>and we want to try to lower the prices again...<< From reading the advertisements in the Underground, I thought the prices were pretty low as is. I'm suprised that would be such a factor. >>This is called progress.<< Which is something that some of us in the Coco Community are unknowingly avoided by refusing to go OS-9/68k when possible. Some of us are rather stubborn about moving on to a better machine(but I would kill for such a machine right now!> Btw, when is the next MOTD due out? You did get my check right? I'm just checking to make sure, since I'm not sure if you got my email. See Ya >Chris< -*- 88559 12-JUL 21:48 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88525) From: CPERRAULT To: DBREEDING >>To begin with, I wouldn't even consider recommending an OS9 machine to a computer illiterate person.<< I have a little different of a view on that. I don't think OS-9 is any harder on the computer illiterate person than Dos, and as a matter of fact would recommend it over Dos. It is much more simplistic to operate. I admit OS-9 is not yet for most people but I think it's good for many more than some of us think. OS-9 as a system is MUCH easier to operate than Dos, judging from what users have told me, and I think I have enough knowledge of OSK and Dos to draw a decent conclusion. The big difference between the two is the often talked about software availability. Dos won't give up this advantage anytime soon, but I think the OSK software has improved enough to give it a decent software base. If someone says "I need Wordperfect" or Dbase or any other specific piece of Dos/windows software, than obviously I have to recommend a PC, as I did recently for the rest of my family when they were looking for a computer to buy my father. I was thinking of recommending an MM/1 but then my sister and others came along saying "Well I wanna run Microsoft Word..." among other things, which we obviously don't have under OSk. Now if they had simply said "Well, I want to do some Word Processing and some Database Developement..." that would be a different story. We have that stuff and we basically have enough software to meet almost all your basic computer app needs. It sure needs some work, but we are in decent enough standing to promote OS-9 machines to those who have GENERAL software needs. I think now's probably as good a time as any to get these machines to some of the larger Computer shows going on around the country. The San Diego Users Group had the right idea. This was a bit long winded, but I just wanted to post it as a response to some of the recent postings regarding OS-9's supposed lack of user friendliness. If you, are referring to the COCO, yes it is lacking obviously, but that is to be expected considering Tandy left it up to us users to hack and patch it up in a million different versions. There's not much we can do about that, nor should we worry about it at this point. Professional OS-9 on the other hand is obviously still supported and is therefore much easier develope for with end users in mind. From what most PRO OS-9 users tell me, installing programs is just as easy as it is with Dos. This just goes to show that when referring the user friendliness situation, you need to make it clear which version of OS-9 you are talking about. Again, this message isn't really directly aimed at you David, I just thought your post was a good opportunity to get my post out. See Ya >Chris< -*- 88562 12-JUL 22:10 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88559) From: BOISY To: CPERRAULT Well worded, Chris. I would like to address the issue of OS-9 (and I mean OSK) not suitable as a personal operating system: I am a firm believer that OS-9 is not only well suited, but optimal as a personal computer operating system. When people think of OSK, they generaly think of xmode, grep, etc... Can you imagine a new computer user trying to use xmode when he/she doesn't have a clue as to the difference between path descriptor and device descriptor? The "key" is to write software that is easy to use, intuitive and spiffy. Mike Haaland's GPORT utility (that comes with DeskTop for the MM/1) allows the user to set baud rate, parity, stop bits, etc. at the click of a mouse button. No typing nasty xmode commands, just point and click. And the interface is very neat... In fact, I've used GPORT as the auxiliary program to interface with a K-Windows terminal program I'm writing. I know I'm picking on xmode here, but there are other computer functions that can be done with class in OS-9. Looking back, Tandy had the right idea with Multi-Vue, though it was way under powered. THe main challenge is to sell people on _WHY_ an OS-9 system would make a good personal computer. THe bottom line for most folks is software. I agree with Chris -- if people want general computing software such as word processing and spreadsheet, then the MM/1 or other OSK systems can fill the need. -*- 88578 13-JUL 00:06 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88559) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT > >>To begin with, I wouldn't even consider recommending an OS9 > machine to a computer illiterate person.<< > > I have a little different of a view on that. I don't think OS-9 > is any harder on the computer illiterate person than Dos, and as a I really think you are right. There's nothing that hard about OSK, and I hope for the day that maybe we'll see OSK provided as a users system. The biggest problem at this time is for the user to know where and how to obtain their software. RE: Coco. Yes, that was one problem I was beginning to run into - all the hacks and stuff, and it was getting to where you just could not get enough memory to do what you really wanted to do. I still haven't gotten all my stuff for my OSK system, but a lot of what I've seen has impressed me very much. Really, what you said about people wanting a specific app is the main thing that would make me hesitate in recommending to someone. Really more in that I would be a little reluctant in taking the responsibility of making the recommendation. I think a lot of people would not be satisfied with software availability right now, even though we can do just about anything any other system can do, and what we can't is just due to the fact that it has never been implemented yet. I'm referring to such things as widespread CD-Rom availability, and the like. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88579 13-JUL 00:07 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88562) From: DBREEDING To: BOISY > Well worded, Chris. > > I would like to address the issue of OS-9 (and I mean OSK) not suitable > as a personal operating system: Again, I heartily agree. The system itself is ideal. Your statements are extremely well on the mark. You hit on the biggest thing right now, and I feel that this is changing, and the key is to get more of "us" in to get a beginning user base so that we can get all the user-friendly stuff going. I think the best thing that could happen to us is to get a common base by which we can easily write software, based on the user interface, that will be universal across all platforms. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88587 13-JUL 20:13 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88562) From: JOHNREED To: BOISY The real advantage that MSDOS has over OSK for the "average" user is one that has been pointed out over and over again. Most MSDOS users never use MSDOS - they have an interface that hides it completely. Just watch your favorite average messydoser when confronted with the dreaded "C>" prompt. He has a look on his face like he is holding a dead rat by the tail. He is every bit as confused as he would be if he had just booted up OS-9. So how do we get these neat interfaces? That is the problem, where do we find a programmer with the skill and the time to write the monster for our little bitty market? What we need is for a relatively large company to assign a programmer or three to come up with a great "user friendly" interface for OS-9, bite the bullet, sell it for peanuts, then sell the development stuff for peanuts too. Maybe that would get enough "slick" programs on the market so we could actually recommend an OSK system to someone who just wants a computer to do a job, not program it as a hobby. ******************************** A stitch in time -------------------- ------ is worth two in the bush John R. Wainwright <> <> -*- 88592 13-JUL 22:23 General Information RE: ChicofeBERG To: CPERRAULT Chris, > >>This is called progress.<< > > Which is something that some of us in the Coco Community are > unknowingly avoided by refusing to go OS-9/68k when possible. Some of > us are rather stubborn about moving on to a better machine(but I would > kill for such a machine right now!> The new machines are wonderful. It was a tough choice for me when I decided I needed a new machine to replace my CoCo -- should I go with a PC or stay with OS-9. I toiled over that for many months, as it's so much money. I finally decided on an OSK machine (the MM/1), and I love it and will never regret making that choice. If you truly love OS-9, an OS-9/68000 based system is truly, in my opinion, the way to go. > Btw, when is the next MOTD due out? We're busy at work finalizing the next issue, and it should be out to everyone shortly. > You did get my check right? > I'm just checking to make sure, since I'm not sure if you got my > email. Carl will answer those questions... ;) Best wishes, ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88598 13-JUL 22:49 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88587) From: MRUPGRADE To: JOHNREED There's a lot of "listen" in John's message. To me "powerful" is supposed to mean "easy to use", andn do "otherwise complicated tasks" with "ease". that's POWERFUL. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- 88617 15-JUL 03:02 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88344) From: BROWN80 To: COLORSYSTEMS I've been running Xenix V on a Compac 286 for several years. I don't greased lightning has to worry about this machine catching up with it, but it works fine. John Brown -*- 88633 15-JUL 23:05 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88578) From: CPERRAULT To: DBREEDING >>...and I hope for the day that maybe we'll see OSK provided as a users system. It is already. Heck you have one of them you lucky Devil ;-) Seriously, when you say that I assume you mean available in as great a supply as PC's and Macs, with the same amount of support? I have dreams of selling 68k machines in my own retail outlet...I gotta stop all this dreamin' or start following up on them :-) >> Yes, that was one problem I was beginning to run into - all the hacks and stuff<< Unfortunately that has been the biggest problem haunting us level II users for years. Technically, even if we don't get MW source, we can still use all the hacks and patches to our advantage by coming up with what we as a community feel would be the ideal 'standard' Coco using all the patches and stuff that we have at our disposal. This is an old idea that can still work if a great majority of Coco users can cast their votes and decide. This type of project is well suited for the UG, assuming they don't have a million other projects tieing them up right now. Any member could carry such a project if he/she is willing to see it through I suppose. I tried it once, and just couldn't get it done for a few reasons. Achieving such a goal would help bring back the usability of the Coco for those who use them and program them. As it is now, almost nobody wants to write programs for it, seeing as it might not run on all the 50 other configurations of it :-( >>...I would be a little reluctant in taking the responsibility of making the recommendation<< I agree, that is the hardest thing. You have a LOT of SOMEONE ELSES money that may technically be in YOUR hands, so it is a good deal of responsibility that you have. I still feel OSK is a great choice for many people, but I must admit it is hard to be unbiased when you are a hardcore OS-9er. I am always asking myself, "Maybe I'm looking at his/her situation the wrong way. What if OSK isn't right...." . Hopefully in time we will get some better CD-Rom materials as well as the other goodies the other systems have as bragging points, but we do have a fairly decent foundation that still needs some work. The best thing to do right now, imo, is to keep supporting the current base of OSK users by not only writing some good utilities and apps, but also getting some more programming Languages and Tools out there. I know Professional OS9 comes with C which is a good deal, and 2 out of the 3 personal machines come with Basic but after that it seems that programming support is a little less than spectacular. For instance, a good Pascal and/or Basic compilor would be nice for those who don't know C. I know C is probably the best way to go, but it shouldn't be the only way. FHL had the right idea when they mentioned their Basix for Gwindows in a posting a good while back. Only problem is, I haven't heard anything 'bout it since :-( . Hopefully it's still in the works. Also, it would be nice if BGFX or some future equivelent were released with Kwindows instead of sold seperately. I imagine there's a good loss in there starting out, but if it helps promote more programming from the communities Basic programmers, it may be worth the gamble for a long term gain. It is a setback I think for Basic programmers who have to require that users buy a graphics subroutine program in order to run graphic based programs. I think the more languages supported, the better we'll do application wise, and I think those should be emphasised much more than Apps at this point since the majority of OSK users are programmers who would love to write those apps, if only they have good tools. So to make a long story short..., I agree :-) >Chris< -*- 88644 16-JUL 11:25 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88633) From: NIMITZ To: CPERRAULT Chris, I would be glad to include BGFX, AND Desktop with every MM/1 sold. How many of you would be willing to pay $35 to 50 extra to get them?? There is not nearly as much margin in an MM/1 system as it would take for me to eat that expense, although the package is already great and getting better with some donations that are coming up...... David -*- 88646 16-JUL 11:39 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88644) From: BOISY To: NIMITZ Yes, Desktop and BGFX would be nice additions to a new MM/1 system. And with the extra software being worked on, I'm sure it will be well worth the extra $35 to $50. -*- 88649 16-JUL 12:01 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88646) From: NIMITZ To: BOISY I certainly think they well be. The question is, will buyers think so. Oh well, I'm working on it! David -*- 88660 16-JUL 15:47 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88633) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT > >>...and I hope for the day that maybe we'll see OSK provided as > a users system. > > It is already. Heck you have one of them you lucky Devil ;-) > Seriously, when you say that I assume you mean available in as > great a supply as PC's and Macs, with the same amount of support? I Yes, we *DO* have it as a user system, but I meant as something for the *GENERAL* user. As I said later, I just couldn't take the responsibility of having a practically computer illiterate person invest in the system. I have two cocos, and set one up for my brother. No HD, but 1 360K and 1 720K 3.5. To be honest, about the only thing he knows about computers is the word "RAM" . I have attempted to set him up with some stuff, all he needs, if he needs anything at all. But he can't or won't get in there and dig for the info. He is a "user" in the strictest sense. All he can talk about is being able to get a PC - something "you can get software for". Now fact is, when/if he gets one, he will have no more power in what he does than now, and he'll probably be in the same boat as he's in now, but at least I won't be setting him up with something "that you can't use". I think this would happen in most cases. As I mentioned before, most people think the only computer there is is a PC. If you get someone to get an OS9/OSK machine, when they go to encountering problems, and they will regardless of what system they get, then you've given them a bum steer. If these same people have a problem with OSK, then you've messed them up, and in their mind, wouldn't have this problem with a PC, whereas if this same problem should occur with a PC, then it's just something that happens. > >> Yes, that was one problem I was beginning to run into - all > the hacks and stuff<< > > Unfortunately that has been the biggest problem haunting us level > II users for years. > Achieving such a goal would help bring back the usability of the > Coco for those who use them and program them. As it is now, almost > nobody wants to write programs for it, seeing as it might not run on > all the 50 other configurations of it :-( > >>...I would be a little reluctant in taking the responsibility > of making the recommendation<< > I agree, that is the hardest thing. You have a LOT of SOMEONE > ELSES money that may technically be in YOUR hands, so it is a good > deal of responsibility that you have. I still feel OSK is a great My point exactly. Maybe I'm just chicken, but in most cases, you get lots less flak if you let them make their own "mistakes". -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88661 16-JUL 15:48 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88644) From: DBREEDING To: NIMITZ > Chris, I would be glad to include BGFX, AND Desktop with every MM/1 > sold. > How many of you would be willing to pay $35 to 50 extra to get them?? I don't know just how such packaging really should be handled, but I think what is needed is some sort of standardization. I'm not all that familiar with BGFX, think it's the equivalent of GFX2 on the CoCo? Anyway, it does add a little complication if a programmer wants to include routines for a run-time module, but must contend with the fact that there may be users who do not have this module. I can see where a potential customer for software might be hesistant if he is faced with the necessity of having to purchase an additional program to run it. As for Desktop, you may already be doing this, but it seems that it should at least be offered as an option installed at time of purchase. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88672 16-JUL 23:55 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88525) From: CBJ To: DBREEDING David, I agree with most of what you wrote except the part about having to to juggle interrupts, etc. The CoCo and the MM1 approach this from a different aspect because of the hardware they use. PC builders and "accessory" manufacturers could have avoided the "interrupt" problem by building the internal modems with a set interrupt but that woul require them to build several different modems. This is due to the way the CPU works and is not determined by the OS. It is strictly a hardware requirement. It is much better the way that they are set up now. Actually there are OSK systems that require the setting of interrupts for the COMM ports. Again this is a hardware requirement. Carl -*- 88677 17-JUL 14:50 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88672) From: DBREEDING To: CBJ (NR) > I agree with most of what you wrote except the part about having to > to juggle interrupts, etc. The CoCo and the MM1 approach this from a > different aspect because of the hardware they use. I have never actually dealt with a PC personally, so only have what I've heard and seen to go on. The point I was really trying to make is that so many people seem to think that OS9 is so user-unfriendly whereas PC's are almost automatic. In actuality, the biggest problem for us is 1) most of us have to order our systems and many have to be set up yourself, and 2) Automatic "install" programs are a little hard to do, since there are so many variables in system setup, and OS9 is by nature, a terminal-oriented environment. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88680 17-JUL 14:53 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88562) From: 01GEN40 To: ALL What is going on here? To me, OS-9 is OS-9! The way you guys are talking, out here, makes me feel as low as a DOS user. Unfortunately, I have to use DOS at work. I do not think I am too far off base here when I say that if it were not for OS-9 (and I mean OS-9), there would be no OS-9 (and I mean OS-9 68000)! If it were not for UNIX there would be no OS-9! Let us not start to alienate out here, if I have a question about OS-9, I would like to be able to come here to get an answer. I am talking OS-9 for my CoCo III here, I do not have a 68XXX machine and do not see getting one in the future. As a matter of fact, I would like to get a 486 and try my hand at OS-9000. Read the next line carefully. See ya. LONG LIVE OS-9! * In whatever form it is in! -= 01GEN40 =- -*- 88703 18-JUL 21:12 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88680) From: DBREEDING To: 01GEN40 (NR) > What is going on here? To me, OS-9 is OS-9! The way you guys are > talking, out here, makes me feel as low as a DOS user. > If it were not for UNIX there would be no OS-9! Let us not start to > alienate out here, if I have a question about OS-9, I would like to > be able to come here to get an answer. I am talking OS-9 for my > CoCo III here, I do not have a 68XXX machine and do not see getting > one in the future. I don't think anyone is trying to bash either system. I think everyone has put forth some pretty valid points. I have gone on to OSK, but am still using my CoCo and still respect it, and to be honest, there are a few sections where the OSK systems have not yet caught up with the CoCo in software development. I do suspect that I will continue to gravitate toward OSK, but the CoCo will always be near and dear to me. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88715 19-JUL 23:49 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88680) From: WA2EGP To: 01GEN40 (NR) I think what they are trying to express is that there are some limitations in the way OS-9 is implimented on the CoCo which is not present in the OSK machines. System RAM can get filled faster, there is a 64K boundary problem that has "overcome" in only a few software packages, speed on the CoCo is lower......that sort of thing. Yes, you can do more fster on an OSK machine, but I don't thing you should throw your CoCo under a steamroller just yet (big grin). BTW, I have an old QT (Helix UniQuad) on the desk here and the CoCo seems a little bit easier to use than that....even my hard drive is faster on the CoCo (grin). I say, IF it works......use it! -*- 88716 19-JUL 23:57 General Information RE: Chico fest (Re: Msg 87973) From: WA2EGP To: MRUPGRADE IF you want to see the relative amount of software for OSK, pick up the phone and call Microware and ask for their sourcebook. It may be a few years old but look through the software section and count just the OSK stuff vs. the 6809 stuff. Surprised the heck outta me! PS. The book is free. -*- 88720 20-JUL 18:41 General Information RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88680) From: JWILKERSON To: 01GEN40 (NR) Well it seems a lot of the K'ers have forgotten their roots and are now dogging us cocoists mercilessly..... That's all right..... I'll just ignore them in all ways..... -- John -*- 88728 20-JUL 21:13 General Information RE: Chico fest (Re: Msg 88716) From: MRUPGRADE To: WA2EGP (NR) > Pick up theh phonne and > ask Microware for their software sourcebook Will all that osftware run on an MM/1 ?? WoW! That's gotta be quite a bit. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- End of Thread. -*- 88515 10-JUL 14:32 General Information Cryptic? From: MRUPGRADE To: CBJ You covered a wide area. And I'd liek to re-comment (if that's a word) on what I mean by cryptic code. i.e. cryptic code = understood, only by those within an insider framework. Or not intelligable to the public. May we step back a bit, and remember in the beginning most all software was written in a manner so that: you had to be somewhat computer fluent, or being a programmer helped in understanding how to use it. Unknowingly programmers were writting programs using terms that only that only programmers could understand. This is fine for hackers. But does not add up to user-friendlyness. And yes, I've seen this trend for needing to know DOS and computer language functions, as part of getting a program up and running. As example: I bought MV Canvas. But not knowing OS-9 I could not get it up and running on my computer. A learned friend in OS, had to make several tries. Further there author said he could not gice a step by step proceedure to do so? Due to possible differences in systems. When I didn't buy the upgrade, whose loss was that? PROGRAMMERS HEAR THIS: If your software is easier to understand and use more people will buy it! My complaint is; and I believe it a valid one; TOO MUCH OS SOFTWARE is written in this manner. And more importantly IT IS NOT NECCESSARY. On the plus side (5 years back) I had Van der Poels OS-mailer. And was amazed that I could simply follow a half page of instructions of what to type,, and WALLA! His mailer was up and running in OS-9, "without a need for me to be a hacker". More recently I've been impressed with Chris Dekker's OS-9 software. With a few lines of which disk to insert, followed by "an INSTALL program", that does the (hacker) work for you. Yet all the modules, and subdirectories, etc. are there for you folks that like to tinker. You mentioned Home-Pac, from the beginning there was a special effort to replace computer terms with common english language. Where it's very easy for many of us to say: Input Data, it's understandable to more, to say: Add new checks. Etc. Why must you have Home-Pac? You don't! Many; perhaps most; "home computer users", could easily grow old and quite happily in the process, while never having a computer in the house. But, many of us enjoy the learning (yes, and tinkering) with them so we have a computer. And if you have one,, it may as well be "useful as well". Many (grin) CoCo users overlook that point. Keeping your check balance? Most of us can do that. But finding the check that Bill Co. said they didn't get,,, last month? Last year? When did you buy that car battery, that just went dead? It's lot faster then sorting though a book or so of hen scratches. And tax time... need I say more? I'll cut the ad short here. But you get the point. Back to the original point,,, I am asking programmers to be less cryptic, with their computer terms in software. Make them easy to install; without OS knowledge. And there will be more people like myself, that will start using (and buying) OS-9. Or is that wrong? for what it's worth,,, Terry Simons -*- 88516 10-JUL 15:49 General Information gen From: ROBERT84 To: ALL at I was hoping to hook up to a amber computer monitor. The monitor has one cable connection for audio and one for video, is it possible to hook up me coco 2 to it. Thanks for the help. Bob -*- 88530 11-JUL 01:25 General Information RE: gen (Re: Msg 88516) From: MITHELEN To: ROBERT84 Not without extra hardware... But, there were 3rd party monochrome monitor adaptors available at one time for the CoCo 2 at a pretty reasonable cost (under 30$), and I believe there was even directions in a Rainbow issue that explained how to build your own (pretty simple circuit) Perhaps Marty Goodman, or Tony Distafano can help you out. I have one on my old CoCo2, but haven't used it in ages... It really is a nice improvement over the TV output. Sorry, but I'm not willing to part with it. Has sentimental value to me (my first computer, built from a parts kit) -- Paul -*- 88533 11-JUL 02:45 General Information RE: gen (Re: Msg 88516) From: COCOKIWI To: ROBERT84 in the old days one hung another MC1732 ..and with a couple of Transistors ...one would have a Video Driver! The CoCo-3 has one built in,along with the R.G.B driver also! MartyGoodman also sold a transistor board that would do that too,his was MONO,mine was color! the Video output is inverted and needs to be changed back to normal,a transistor or two will do that and boost it a little to get proper levels! OK! Dennis -*- End of Thread. -*- 88518 10-JUL 16:12 General Information help From: ROBERT84 To: ALL I got one more question, I have 1 coco 3 512k hooked up to 2 disk drives and a 30 meg hard drive with a tandy (old) multi-pak. Is it possible, and if so how could I hook up a second coco3 and monitor to the 30 meg hard drive. So that I could use it as a remote terminal type thing. Thanks again for all the help. Bob -*- 88586 13-JUL 19:56 General Information RE: help (Re: Msg 88518) From: MIKE_GUZZI To: ROBERT84 if you want to use a second coco as a terminal, you need a serial port on the main coco (like a deluxe rs232 pak, or like me a COMM-4) and then on the second coco run a terminal program (like ultimaterm or supercomm) to access the main coco. I do this alot since i have two coco's both have hard disks, but the second one is connected to my main one VIA /T5 and that second coco has 2 rs232 paks (in case i hook a modem to it) to physically share the hard disks, there is only one option. buy KEN-TON's SCSI adaptors (2 of them) one will be modified (i think) then you need to hook the hard disks to SCSI if there not already. then both coco's can physically share the hard disks. I was planning to do this (it would cost about $90 for me) but i just saw it as impractical since I don't need to access the main hard disks much from the second coco Mike -*- 88674 17-JUL 14:25 General Information RE: help (Re: Msg 88586) From: 01GEN40 To: ROBERT84 (NR) Hi Robert, MIKE_GUZZI missed mentioning 1 very important point when it comes to using 2 rs232 paks at the same time. That point is that all the paks are addressed the same so you will have to re-address one pakfor this to work. I think I still have a text file that explains, in good detail, how to do this modification. This modification also requires that the descriptor you use must have the new address in it as well. I had my CoCos set up so that I could go online here on Delphi and down- load a huge file and still be able to do other things as well on the CoCo used as aterminal. I also did not use TSMON or LOGIN to use my terminal. All I did was to start a new SHELL and redirect it to the /T discriptor for my modified rs232 pak. I think that the text file I mentioned earlier might be here on Delphi, I am not sure. I did this about 2 years ago and do not remember where I found the file. If it is not here, and if I do still have it, I can E-Mail it to you if you so request. See Ya. LONG LIVE OS-9! * In whatever form it is in! -= 01GEN40 =- -*- End of Thread. -*- 88519 10-JUL 16:49 General Information Need an OS LV II From: MRUPGRADE To: ALL This has been asked before but,, I've just sold my last OS-9 Level II w/manual etc. And would like to have more one hand. Deos anyone have one (or more) for sale? NOTE: to sysops,, there are several listings in Clas/ For Sale,, which can no longer recieve mail? (presumable no longer on Delphi) Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- 88520 10-JUL 17:07 General Information RE: Need an OS LV II (Re: Msg 88519) From: BOISY To: MRUPGRADE Does this mean that you're going to get into OS-9 Terry? -*- 88522 10-JUL 18:41 General Information RE: Need an OS LV II (Re: Msg 88520) From: MRUPGRADE To: BOISY Well, it really means I'm helping others get into OS-9. i like to have a LEV II on hand,, when one of our members wants one. as for myself,,, Like I said,, Chris Dekkers software is engourageing to me,, as soon as Ben can config me a OSTERM,, I'm gonna give that a try. You might say,, I'm gettin my feet (er at least toes) wet. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- End of Thread. -*- 88526 10-JUL 19:42 General Information RE: nitro/lha (Re: Msg 88452) From: DSRTFOX To: DBREEDING Well David, the NEW LHA seems to work on everything! Others who d\l'd the .ar version didn't appear to have a problem... for some odd reason I did! Might have been the fact that I d/l'd to DECB then transferred to OS-9 via the RSDOS command. At any rate, everything is fine now! Thanks for the help. -*- 88531 11-JUL 01:31 General Information RE: nitro/lha (Re: Msg 88526) From: MITHELEN To: DSRTFOX Ya.. come to think about it, doesn't that rsdos to os9 transfer/converter program have problems if the file is over a certain size... I know ther was a patch to make it handle larger files, but I don't know if it removed the size limit entirely... -- Paul -*- 88580 13-JUL 00:08 General Information RE: nitro/lha (Re: Msg 88526) From: DBREEDING To: DSRTFOX > Well David, the NEW LHA seems to work on everything! Others who d\l'd the > .ar version didn't appear to have a problem... for some odd reason I did! Glad to hear you got it fixed. Forget which version I dl'ed, but it works great. It seems to work really smooth. > Thanks for the help. Whatever I did, glad to be of help. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- End of Thread. -*- 88527 10-JUL 21:10 General Information Hello From: REVWCP To: ALL Dear Friends: Hello from Long Island. I am on-line from CHARLESAM's with REVKAK standing behind me. OFNOHOC comes to LI. I will be back to normal, (as much as the case may be) friday. Having a wonderful time, wish you were here. With all best wishes, Brother Jeremy, CSJW OS9 User Group Treasurer -*- 88537 11-JUL 15:48 General Information DCHECK From: MROWEN01 To: ALL I have just spend about four days trying to reconstruct my hard disk. I don't know if I just had corrupt files or what. I restored from backups made with stream. The system would flake out once in awhile and I would get 244 and 245 errors. When I try to use dcheck on /h0 it reports some files and then stops with an error 211. Is dcheck reliable? I ran scand to check the disk and it was OK. This is after running format, B&B ccheck, and zapping a few entries in the directory. I can run dcheck multiple times and it will report different files each time. Is there a utility out there that can sanity check my file system better than dcheck? All low level utils say the physical disk is good, but I still run into an occasional 245 when restoring with stream. Thanks! -Mike -*- 88588 13-JUL 20:43 General Information RE: DCHECK (Re: Msg 88537) From: MIKE_GUZZI To: MROWEN01 first run dcheck with using another device for its temp files such as /r0 the command like goes like this dcheck -w=/r0 /h0 that will help, the #245 is a write error, you might have some flakey sectors on the hard disk, B&B utility CCHECK will remove these after formatting (but can be used while files occupy the disk) These utilities are with the file system repack package ( a must have!) once ccheck identifies the bad areas you can tell ccehck to list the files occuping the bad areas, zap them off and then restore them from backup. that should prevent barfing from dcheck and furthur damage. BTW: CCheck and most of his utils are useless if you clustered your hard disk! -*- End of Thread. -*- 88539 11-JUL 22:08 OSK Applications Weeks absence From: NIMITZ To: ALL I'll be away from Delph for 1 to 2 weeks in order to swap I/O boards back from a developer who needed to check quality of sound support. Ray Patterson will be working on getting something done about CD file managers for OSK, with CD-I support. Sales are up, much is looking uup. Thanks all. -*- 88565 12-JUL 22:39 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88539) From: HAWKSOFT To: NIMITZ Dave! > Ray Patterson will be working on getting something done about CD file > managers for OSK, with CD-I support. Sales are up, much is looking uup. > Thanks all. If you need some testing done (beta,gamma,delta, or otherwise) MY hand is UP!!!!!! I've been waitng for a CD file manager!!! (Could it be ported to other OSK systems as well???) Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88584 13-JUL 19:31 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88565) From: NIMITZ To: HAWKSOFT Chris we are looking at a complete file manager, so so long as drivers were written for the other machines, it should be no problem. BTW - A friend loaned me a Tandy 1110 HD notebook machine. I'm tempted to see if Mike Smith might want to do a MM/1 compatible notebook???? David -*- 88593 13-JUL 22:24 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88584) From: RANDYKWILSON To: NIMITZ David, Many (many many) moons ago I talked to PKW about this, and now I'm gonna tell you the same thing. I'd kill for a OSK laptop/notebook! Randy -*- 88603 14-JUL 06:43 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88593) From: JEJONES To: RANDYKWILSON > Many (many many) moons ago I talked to PKW about this, and now I'm gonna > tell you the same thing. I'd kill for a OSK laptop/notebook! I wouldn't kill, but I'd subject somebody to a Village People greatest hits CD in repeat mode. :-) Seriously, I'd buy one. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88627 15-JUL 20:50 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88584) From: HAWKSOFT To: NIMITZ Hi David! > Chris we are looking at a complete file manager, so so long as drivers > were written for the other machines, it should be no problem. Great! If I can provide any help or testing, let me know! I have a CDRom drive on my MM/1 and can play Audio CDs AND read CD-I disks!! It took a LOT of reading and poking around, but, the NEC CDRoms DO have the capability to read CD-I. Oh, it can read messydos CDs too. Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88637 16-JUL 01:14 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88627) From: LARRYOLSON To: HAWKSOFT > > If I can provide any help or testing, let me know! I have a CDRom drive > on my MM/1 and can play Audio CDs AND read CD-I disks!! It took a LOT of > reading and poking around, but, the NEC CDRoms DO have the capability to > read CD-I. Chris, While I'm thinking of it, what is the model number of the NEC CDrom that you have ? Where did you pick up your drive ? Larry ----- Larry Olson ----- -*- 88639 16-JUL 03:34 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88637) From: MITHELEN To: LARRYOLSON I use a NEC cdr-25bg on my system, I think the drive Chris has is basically the same drive (although, it looks a little different) It is a single speed, pop top model. You can find them at Computer Flea markets really cheep since they are old technology (I think they are even discontinued now) The latest price I've heard on them, is 69$.... Not a bad deal at all. -- Paul -*- 88650 16-JUL 12:05 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88593) From: NIMITZ To: RANDYKWILSON But would you pay $2500 for it?? ;) Seriously, I am considering this. But first I need to find a board stuffing house for the MM/1 I/O boards. Maybe I'll talk to Mike Smith about a laptop...... David -*- 88671 16-JUL 23:17 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88584) From: WA2EGP To: NIMITZ Don't tease me that way!!! -*- 88682 17-JUL 17:20 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88637) From: HAWKSOFT To: LARRYOLSON Larry: I have an NEC cdr25. I got it from Mark Griffith (Dirt Cheap Computer Stuff) at the Atlanta 'fest last year. It is a single speed external model. You should be able to pick one (or a similar model) up for $100 or less. You would also need the driver/descriptor. (Available from Dirt Cheap). Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88683 17-JUL 17:21 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88639) From: HAWKSOFT To: MITHELEN > I use a NEC cdr-25bg on my system, I think the drive Chris has is > basically the same drive (although, it looks a little different) It is a > single speed, pop top model. You can find them at Computer Flea markets > really cheep since they are old technology (I think they are even > discontinued now) The latest price I've heard on them, is 69$.... Not a > bad deal at all. -- > Paul Yup! BTW When are YOU going to purchase VCDP! The graphics Virtual CD Player?? Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88687 17-JUL 23:56 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88683) From: MITHELEN To: HAWKSOFT As soon as you put the universal symbols on the buttons, so it looks as slick as "workman" under OpenWindows -- Paul -*- 88688 18-JUL 00:01 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88650) From: RANDYKWILSON To: NIMITZ David, The machine that I would want (I do have a specific app in mind; one that I'm currently using a ms-dos laptop for and hating it) would not be cheap. And realize that the market would be fairly small, so there would be no volume to amortize development costs. So... $2500 for my machine, yes. $2500 for a machine with lots of glitz and no FPU, no. To answer your next question.... Strong CPU with a FPU 768x480 mono small (by todays standards) hard drive, say 120 meg. Three serial (at least one capable of 57600) One parallel Expensive color LCD's not needed or wanted Built in pointer devices not needed (besides, I've yet to find one that is usable left handed) Randy -*- 88689 18-JUL 00:02 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88687) From: MITHELEN To: HAWKSOFT Oh, and, them Nec CDR25's are down to $59 at computer surplus flea markets. -*- 88694 18-JUL 01:33 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88682) From: LARRYOLSON To: HAWKSOFT > I have an NEC cdr25. I got it from Mark Griffith (Dirt Cheap Computer > Stuff) at the Atlanta 'fest last year. It is a single speed external > model. You should be able to pick one (or a similar model) up for $100 > or less. You would also need the driver/descriptor. (Available from > Dirt Cheap). Chris, I finally got in touch with Mark, but he said that he didn't sell the drives anymore, so I just need some model numbers to be looking for as I scan Computer shopper or maybe I should look in some Mac magazines. Thanks, larry ----- Larry Olson ----- -*- 88731 20-JUL 21:35 OSK Applications RE: Weeks absence (Re: Msg 88694) From: HAWKSOFT To: LARRYOLSON Hi Larry! > I finally got in touch with Mark, but he said that he didn't sell the > drives anymore, so I just need some model numbers to be looking for as > I scan Computer shopper or maybe I should look in some Mac magazines. Stick with Computer Shopper and Ham 'fests/Flea Markets. Mac stuff is always over priced (the same stuff, no less). As a wise man once said: "Macs are for people with more money than brains." So long as the drive is SCSI it should work. Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- End of Thread. -*- 88540 11-JUL 22:15 General Information OSTERM Yeah! From: MRUPGRADE To: BOISY Well, Boisy looks like I finally made it on on (beleive it or not) with OSTERM !!! Seems OS wants the Disk I/O in slot four. picky picky BTW,, I tried IN%listserv@pucc.princeton.edu" but there's something there IN doesn't like? Any one got any ideas?? Til then,, Terry g -*- 88544 11-JUL 23:59 General Information RE: OSTERM Yeah! (Re: Msg 88540) From: JOHNBAER To: MRUPGRADE Hello Terry.. > BTW,, I tried IN%listserv@pucc.princeton.edu" but there's something > there IN doesn't like? Any one got any ideas?? I won't go into the details here but, FROM Delphi, send it like this: IN%"@pucc.princeton.edu:listserv@pucc.bitnet" Type it just the way it is here. Delphi in NOT on bitnet, but the pucc.princeton.edu address IS a gateway to bitnet. I went nuts for a week until I found that this way works . Have fun... -- John - < Posted with Ved 2.3.1 & IX 1.2.0 > -*- 88549 12-JUL 18:43 General Information RE: OSTERM Yeah! (Re: Msg 88540) From: ISC To: MRUPGRADE Terry, You missed the open quote (") in the Internet mail address. It should be: IN%"listserv@pucc.princeton.edu". Bill -*- 88550 12-JUL 21:16 General Information RE: OSTERM Yeah! (Re: Msg 88540) From: JEJONES To: MRUPGRADE > BTW,, I tried IN%listserv@pucc.princeton.edu" but there's something > there IN doesn't like? Any one got any ideas?? Yup. Balance your quotation marks. I've always spelled out "internet," so I'm not sure exactly how the short form should read, but you could give internet"listserv@pucc.princeton.edu" a try. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88568 12-JUL 23:09 General Information RE: OSTERM Yeah! (Re: Msg 88549) From: MRUPGRADE To: ISC It seemed to work,,, we'll see. Thanx,, Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- End of Thread. -*- 88541 11-JUL 22:32 Programmers Den RE: Renaming a file in C (Re: Msg 88427) From: CPERRAULT To: ILLUSIONIST (NR) Neat. That comes in handy for a person like me who puts his bigger apps executables in a directory below /dd/cmds such as /dd/cmds/profile or something like that. If the app needed one of the OS-9 Commands, it could just reference it's own directory for it, even if it's not there. >>I can have only one copy of say, EDIT on the disk, but it can be accessed from any of the other directories...<< Fortunately that is. I would hate to give to much disk space to 'Edit' See Ya >Chris< -*- 88542 11-JUL 22:32 Programmers Den RE: Latest in Basic problems (Re: Msg 88439) From: CPERRAULT To: ILLUSIONIST (NR) >>PS. I think that is even gonna dump, because Basic shouldn't have eto be forced to adding the eos marker..<< Your right. I took that piece of code out since it was no use. It made for an interesting experience anyway. See Ya >Chris< -*- 88557 12-JUL 21:47 Programmers Den RE: Latest in Basic problems (Re: Msg 88486) From: CPERRAULT To: PAGAN >>I recall you passed a raw directory entry to the routine which is terminated with high bit set so Basic09, looking for a $ff, was unable to find the end of it.<< Sort of a moot point now(well not really), but if I reset the high bit back to normal(and it is no longer Raw), is Basic09 automatically able to find the $ff? I hope you all are looking forward to my next message full of complaints and questions about my program, since there is a lot of them soon to come ;- ) See Ya >Chris "Maybe Basic09 isn't that easy after all?" Perrault< -*- 88583 13-JUL 00:11 Programmers Den RE: Latest in Basic problems (Re: Msg 88557) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT > Sort of a moot point now(well not really), but if I reset the > high bit back to normal(and it is no longer Raw), is Basic09 > automatically able to find the $ff? Seems like I saw a post that you had the directory entry solved, but maybe you're still having problems? If so, here's a sample of code that should work, typing off the top of my head here, but... (* you might want the directory entry to a var, call it dn DIM dn:string[31] DIM ch:BYTE DIM pt:INTEGER pt = ADDR(dn) WHILE (LAND(PEEK(pt),$80) = 0 ) DO pt=pt+1 ENDWHILE POKE pt, LAND(PEEK(pt),$7f) POKE pt+1,$FF This should get the directory entry into basic format. You may have had the problem already solved, but this might give you an alternative method. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88602 14-JUL 00:10 Programmers Den RE: Latest in Basic problems (Re: Msg 88583) From: WDTV5 To: CPERRAULT One other reply in this thread triggered another gotcha possibility on getting the directory entry into memory. That is (& we already covered it earlier I think) that each directory entry is 32 bytes long. Because of this I always define 2 vars and read them both in the loop so that the reads are in fact in step with this 32 byte size. The name is of course the first 29 or less bytes with the remainder being whatever was there before *unless* you make a habit of running my gsort on the directory quite often. Gsort cleans up the garbage between the end of the name and the last 3 bytes of that 32 byte assignment for each slot. Thats incidental though. What counts is the reading from the disk the full 32 bytes for each slot of the directory file. And of course I always do a seek #path,64 just to skip the first two entries which are the infamous . and .. entries. There have been a multitude of answers to this problem presented and at least 4 or 5 of them will work. If its not working yet, let us see the code you are using, that "paragraph" so to speak, along with the declarations of the vars used. Its not that heavy duty a problem, really! The gotcha I was refering to was one fellows defined string of 31 bytes. Thats one byte short, thereby getting you out of time/step for reading the NEXT entry. I define mine as string(32) and byte(3). Not that exact syntax of course, but the mail I sent should have shown the exact syntax. That code works and has for several years now. Cheers from WV, Gene -*- 88635 15-JUL 23:05 Programmers Den RE: Latest in Basic problems (Re: Msg 88583) From: CPERRAULT To: DBREEDING >>...But maybe you're still having problems?<< Nope, at least not anymore with that section of the program, but I'm gonna take down your example anyway. It's the first time I've seen such code done using PEEK and POKE statements, which I haven't worked with before with OS-9. >Chris< -*- 88664 16-JUL 15:51 Programmers Den RE: Latest in Basic problems (Re: Msg 88635) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT > I'm gonna take down your example anyway. It's the first time I've seen > such code done using PEEK and POKE statements, which I haven't worked > with before with OS-9. That example was just a quickie thing I wrote off the top of my head. You might have to embellish on it a little to do what you want it to do. Someone pointed out that my example was dim'd wrong. It was not for disk read, and actually, I had forgotten, was thinking that the filename size was 30 bytes instead of 29. This example was for an alternate variable space, and I would add an extra byte for the terminator, in this case. If I remember correctly, Basic allows you to store up to the string size, that is, if you dim xx:string[29] then you can have a string of 29 bytes, and don't use the $FF terminator. To add an extra byte takes up more space, but you don't have to worry about this case when parsing the filename. Of course as he pointed out, my example would not work for a directory read. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- End of Thread. -*- 88547 12-JUL 03:26 General Information RE: RFI (Re: Msg 88460) From: MMCCLELLAND To: MARTYGOODMAN Marty- Thanks for the info! I'll try some of your suggestions when I open my CoCo up to install the 6309. A few days ago, I tried to install a Teac 3.5 inch, 1.44 Meg floppy that had been accidentally connected to 12 volts. When I tried to read a disk, I got both read and write errors. I proceeded to dismantle the drive, and noticed a burnt IC (a Teac(?) 3479). It appears to be a stepper motor controller. During a format, I noticed that the heads stepped erratically, as if the motor was receiving pulses that were too short or out of order. The rest of the drive appears to function properly. Any suggestions on how it might be repaired? Is it worth the effort? Thanks again for all of the help! -=Mark=- -*- 88589 13-JUL 20:44 General Information RE: RFI (Re: Msg 88547) From: MIKE_GUZZI To: MMCCLELLAND forget it! its probably a custum chip and floppy drives are cheap enough nowadays to just toss them when they go bad -*- 88628 15-JUL 21:07 General Information RE: RFI (Re: Msg 88465) From: MARTYGOODMAN To: RICKULAND I'm interested to hear that... I would not have expected a simple sheet of aluminum... even if grounded... to have had that much effect. Curious! ---marty -*- 88630 15-JUL 21:11 General Information RE: RFI (Re: Msg 88547) From: MARTYGOODMAN To: MMCCLELLAND I know of no source for the chips in question. Anyway, I don't consider floppy drives to be WORTH repairing. One pickes up used 3.5 in drives at flea markets for $5 to $20 each in my area, and a replacement chip could take hours to locate, and cost $5 or more. Just not worth the trouble. Anyway, if the thing was given improper voltages, it's probably damaged in ways other than that one chip, and is not worth repairing on those grounds. ---marty -*- End of Thread. -*- 88548 12-JUL 03:40 Games & Graphics RE: shanghai (Re: Msg 88318) From: EARTHER To: DENNYWRIGHT RE: error #201 in Shanghai OS-9. I suspect that you don't have enough window devices available for Shanghai OS-9 to run properly? Three type-8 windows (40 x 24) are required for the game to work. Each window will use up 32K of RAM so be sure you have enough RAM available before starting the game. Let me know what happens. Shawn Driscoll Multi-Vue Borg -*- 88551 12-JUL 21:29 Telecom (6809) Hey somebody help me From: SAUSAGESAM To: ALL Hello everybody. I'm having a little trouble getting my 14.4k modem to work under OS9. It just locks up when I get stuff. When I use Ultimaterm it works just fine, but when I try to use it at all under OS9 I can't. Does anybody have any help? -*- 88555 12-JUL 21:40 Telecom (6809) RE: Hey somebody help me (Re: Msg 88551) From: MITHELEN To: SAUSAGESAM sounds like an IRQ lock... Do you have SACia, and the Edition #9 clock modules installed? Also, what RS-232 port you using... you will need one that has RTS/CTS lines fully supported. -- Paul -*- 88563 12-JUL 22:21 Telecom (6809) RE: Hey somebody help me (Re: Msg 88555) From: SAUSAGESAM To: MITHELEN I'm using slot #1... I don't know about Sacia and the clock modules.... Hey is there any way to check how much time you've used in a month on here? -*- 88571 12-JUL 23:31 Telecom (6809) RE: Hey somebody help me (Re: Msg 88563) From: MITHELEN To: SAUSAGESAM Ok.. look in the System Modules database for SAcia, and Clock Edition #9, they replace the standard ACIAPAK, and clock modules, and _should_ solve your lockup problem... Also, make sure you don't set your comm program faster than 9600 baud, the stock coco (and even performanced modified ones) can really handle faster then that (without more advanced RS-232 interfaces) -- Paul -*- 88573 12-JUL 23:37 Telecom (6809) RE: Hey somebody help me (Re: Msg 88571) From: SAUSAGESAM To: MITHELEN So I can't go at 19,200 under OS9?????? That's sad.. I'm doing it now in DECB but I can't stand DECB... -*- 88576 12-JUL 23:51 Telecom (6809) RE: Hey somebody help me (Re: Msg 88573) From: MITHELEN To: SAUSAGESAM Not with your current RS-232 pack (and, unfortanately, the RS-232 packs that will let you handle higher speeds, arn't on the market yet) Under DECB, the coco only has to worry about one thing, and can grab the data from the RS-232 port much easier. The additional overhead from OS-9's multitasking puts 19.2k baud just outa reach with an unbuffered uart. -- Paul -*- 88676 17-JUL 14:49 Telecom (6809) RE: Hey somebody help me (Re: Msg 88573) From: JHICKLE To: SAUSAGESAM Even with Sacia and the clock patches, with yer terminal set at 9600, best you can get is around 500 characters per second on a download, though uploads go a lot faster. -*- End of Thread. -*- 88552 12-JUL 21:31 Telecom (6809) Locked out of HD From: CHARLESAM To: MITHELEN Paul, I'm locked off my HD because I remerged shell and forgot to set the attributes. Geez, how many times do I have to make this mistake before I remember. Problem is after I use a floppy boot and load both HDisk and H0, I forget how to get them to be recognized. I tried link and iniz and neither seem to work. What else must I do? HELP! I promise I'll always try to remember to set attr in the future. Thanx Charlie -*- 88553 12-JUL 21:36 Telecom (6809) RE: Locked out of HD (Re: Msg 88552) From: MITHELEN To: CHARLESAM You might try adding the h0 and hdisk modules to the floppy boot. Some hard drik drivers don't likew to be loadded after boot time... -- Paul -*- 88582 13-JUL 00:10 Telecom (6809) RE: Locked out of HD (Re: Msg 88552) From: DBREEDING To: CHARLESAM > Paul, I'm locked off my HD because I remerged shell and forgot to set the > attributes. You need to keep an emergency floppy boot disk handy for cases like this. make up a floppy with your necessary drivers, etc and have CMDS and grfdrv & shell on it. A trick Disto uses is to have your /h0 on this disk named something else (they use /hf). Since it can't find /h0, it defaults to reattr your shell or whatever else you need to do. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88596 13-JUL 22:33 Telecom (6809) RE: Locked out of HD (Re: Msg 88582) From: CHARLESAM To: DBREEDING I do have an emerg boot but because of the way it is setup, os9 loads grfdrv from /d0 but then links shell from /h0 I have to make a boot with everything I need on /d0 including startup and rename /h0 /hf as suggested so everything will load from /d0. Then I'll change data directory to /hf. Bingo! Thanx Charlie -*- 88601 13-JUL 23:51 Telecom (6809) RE: Locked out of HD (Re: Msg 88596) From: MITHELEN To: CHARLESAM The real "fix" is topatch your init module to look for /dd as the boot device. Then just make a boot that has a dd descriptor that points to your floppy drive, and you can then leave the hard drive as /h0 -- Paul -*- 88607 14-JUL 21:01 Telecom (6809) RE: Locked out of HD (Re: Msg 88601) From: CHARLESAM To: MITHELEN Okay Paul, I copy that. Now all I need is TIME. Been exceptionally busy this week. Sunday Brother Jeremy and Keith(REVKAK) were here for about 8 hours. Really nice evening with plenty of computer discussion. Wish I could do that every week. Learn alot that way. There are alot of really good people involved with this machine. I'm glad to be part of it, small part that may be. Thanx again, Charlie -*- End of Thread. -*- 88554 12-JUL 21:39 General Information OS TERM From: MRUPGRADE To: ALL Does OSTERM require hh disk interf in slot 4 And th 232 pac in Slot 1 ?? or is that jusast theh oconfig of my OS Term? Can it be changed Drive interface in Slot 4 gives my (cramped) computer area a problem. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- 88556 12-JUL 21:43 General Information RE: OS TERM (Re: Msg 88554) From: MITHELEN To: MRUPGRADE With unmodified hardware/software, that is how you must have th packs set up, for any OS9 terminal program. - Paul -*- 88570 12-JUL 23:30 General Information RE: OS TERM (Re: Msg 88554) From: KSCALES To: MRUPGRADE > Does OSTERM require hh disk interf in slot 4 And th 232 pac in Slot 1 ?? > or is that jusast theh oconfig of my OS Term? Can it be changed > Drive interface in Slot 4 gives my (cramped) computer area a problem. The standard software that controls the floppy drive (it is a module called CC3Disk) is written to enable slot 4 as the active MultiPak slot for addressing the floppy, and to enable slot 1 as the source for interrupts which are used by the RS232 pak. The reason behind this is due to limitations in the design of the MultiPak. It wasn't designed to handle the more advanced requirements of OS-9. (Hardly any DECB programs are sophisticated enough in their use of the external hardware to require using interrupts -- Ultimaterm may be an exception that does this as an option, I believe.) As a result, Radio Shack established a standard configuration for the hardware to make it easier for non-techies to set up the system. Of course, the more demanding OS-9 users established ways to enable other configurations. As you test out the OS-9 waters, you may encounter several situations like this, and should be able to get quick answers here on how to deal with them. For this particular configuration restriction, you may only need a one-byte patch to the CC3Disk module to allow your reconfiguration. (I've been away from Level 2 for too long, and my memory is getting fuzzy -- I may have forgotten some details.) A more preferable approach would be to go directly to the root cause, and make a minor hardware mod to the MultiPak (strap all pin-8s together -- possibly skipping one slot if you need to retain the ability to use autostart RomPak games.) We can give you more details if you need them. Regards... / Ken -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken Scales Delphi:KSCALES Internet:kscales@delphi.com CIS:74646,2237 =-=-=-=-=-= Intel: Putting the backward in backward compatible =-=-=-=-=-= -*- 88604 14-JUL 06:43 General Information RE: OS TERM (Re: Msg 88554) From: JEJONES To: MRUPGRADE > Does OSTERM require hh disk interf in slot 4 And th 232 pac in Slot 1 ?? That's not a property of OSTERM, but rather of the device drivers. As long as the system calls work as advertised, OSTERM doesn't care. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88606 14-JUL 19:13 General Information RE: OS TERM (Re: Msg 88604) From: MRUPGRADE To: JEJONES So,,, could device drivers be easily changed, without a lot of other hazards? disk in slot 2 or 3 ?? Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- 88611 15-JUL 00:17 General Information RE: OS TERM (Re: Msg 88606) From: MDALENE To: MRUPGRADE > So,,, could device drivers be easily changed, without a lot of > other hazards? disk in slot 2 or 3 ?? > Til then,,, Terry Simons > You can change the slot assignments in the MPI if you know where the slot select code is in cc3disk driver by simply changing that value to the desired values. Only thing is, where is the slot select code of cc3disk? Some authors of os9 drivers are sympathetic to the coco-os9 user and provide you the slot select addresses that their programs use and some even give you a modpatch script to change them. Examples of such software pachages are: SACIA, Matt Thompsons SCSI 1.0 system. and I also think SCSI 4.7. Being I have a Burke and Burke system. Chris Burke also allows you to change your slot selection while you are creating your HD device descriptors. Michele Marie Dalene -*- 88619 15-JUL 03:48 General Information RE: OS TERM (Re: Msg 88606) From: JEJONES To: MRUPGRADE > So,,, could device drivers be easily changed, without a lot of > other hazards? disk in slot 2 or 3 ?? I don't know enough about that to say--perhaps someone who knows more about the hardware than I do will reply. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- End of Thread. -*- 88560 12-JUL 21:48 Applications (6809) Infoexpress Trouble From: CPERRAULT To: ALL I am currently having trouble getting Infoexpress to dial. I am using the Level II version of IX, with Sacia and it's t2. I am pretty sure it's my modem and it's settings, but everything I've tried hasn't worked. My modem is an AMT Star 2400e. Does anyone know if there is an incompatibility problem with this modem? What is happening is, I will hit the online command, or the manual dial, but when it is supposed to dial, it just sends the init string to the modem. It doesn't dial, but just sits there momentarily and does nothing until it returns a MODEM ERROR string. Mark and Bill are both about as lost on this as I am, which tells me it has to be something with the Modem. >Chris< -*- 88572 12-JUL 23:36 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88560) From: MITHELEN To: CPERRAULT First off, does the modem claim "Hayes Compatiblity"? Also, you probably want set to full verbose result codes. Does the modem autop dial fine with normal terminal programs? -- Paul -*- 88581 13-JUL 00:09 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88560) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT > I am currently having trouble getting Infoexpress to dial. I am > using the Level II version of IX, with Sacia and it's t2. I am pretty > sure it's my modem and it's settings, > Does anyone know if there is an incompatibility problem with this modem? > What is happening is, I will hit the online command, or the > manual dial, but when it is supposed to dial, it just sends the init > string to the modem flash briefly>. It doesn't dial, but just sits there momentarily and > does nothing until it returns a MODEM ERROR string. Mark and Bill are I don't think this would affect the dialing, but do you have modem set to send a CD at all times (Hayes=at &c0)? I _think_ ix looks at the returned strings for autodial response. Seems I tried it once, believe it _did_ dial but would not go through logon process. Do you get anything back on the screen? My ix shows the ATZ, etc, that it sends. Have you reviewed your config.ini file to be sure it is initializing correctly? One other idea, are you setting your baud? Kinda obvious, but it's something _I_ might do . -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88632 15-JUL 23:04 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88572) From: CPERRAULT To: MITHELEN >>First off, does the modem claim "Hayes Compatibility"? Yes. >>Also, you probably want set to full verbose result codes. I have tried all atx commands, from 1-4. None have shown any improvement unfortunately :-( >>Does the modem auto diala fine with normal terminal programs? Yes, it operates fine in every way when I use Supercomm or any other Term for that matter. I know it is the fault of IX, it is just finding WHERE in IX that is killing me. >Chris< -*- 88634 15-JUL 23:05 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88581) From: CPERRAULT To: DBREEDING >>, but do you have modem set to send a CD at alal times..<< Well I tried your suggestion, and no dice :-( Does anyone know if maybe their might be some sort of incompatibility between IX and any Level II patches or Sacia? Here's where our previous messages about Level II hacks and patches begin to make sense David. I'm gonna bet there is something either buggy with the IX I have, or maybe my descriptor isn't agreeing with it? >>One other idea, are you setting your baud?<< Yep >> Kinda obvious, but it's something _I_ might do .<< Join the club LOL. That makes two of us who will open up to check the Tv set for power supply problems before realizing we didn't plug it in >Chris< -*- 88648 16-JUL 11:50 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88632) From: SCWEGERT To: CPERRAULT > I have tried all atx commands, from 1-4. None have shown any > improvement unfortunately :-( I doubt it's IX causing your problems, but more a setting with the modem. If it's truely Hayse compliant, then you should have no difficultiy making it work properly. BTW, the atx commands having nothing to do with the verbose mode of the modem, does it? Shouldn't you be looking at the ATV parameter as well as the ATE. > Yes, it operates fine in every way when I use Supercomm or any > other Term for that matter. So ... if you're using another terminal program, what's reported when you issue a ATZ command? How about when you make a successful connection to another system? > I know it is the fault of IX, it is just finding WHERE in IX that > is killing me. IX has 3 variables in the OSK version that deals with the modem ...ModemInit, ModemReset, ModemHangup. I've been using the default values that came with IX and haven't had any difficulties. *- Steve -* -*- 88663 16-JUL 15:50 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88634) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT > Does anyone know if maybe their might be some sort of > incompatibility between IX and any Level II patches or Sacia? I don't know of any, compatibility problems. Here's my xmode of /t2, maybe you might duplicate some of the stuff. One thing you might be sure of is the "par". I found that with some Clock modules, if xoff is sent to the modem in cmd mode, and the modem will return the xoff, then you are in a locked-up condition. You're shut out of the modem by the received xoff and cannot send an xon to turn it back on. Another wild stab, but possibly. This happens in supercomm it you open a capture file then close it while in command mode. Not all Clocks will do this. nam=T2 mgr=SCF ddr=SACIA hpn=07 hpa=FF68 upc=00 bso=01 dlo=00 eko=01 alf=01 nul=00 pau=00 pag=18 bsp=08 del=18 eor=0D eof=1B rpr=09 dup=19 psc=17 int=03 qut=05 bse=08 ovf=07 par=02 bau=04 xon=11 xof=13 col=50 row=18 xtp=05 wnd=05 val= sty= cpx= cpy= fgc= bgc= bdc= Can't remember the "par" setting but you need to have "xmit xoff" I think turned off. > I'm gonna bet there is something either buggy with the IX I have, > or maybe my descriptor isn't agreeing with it? I don't think that "IX" is at fault per se. One other thing, possibly. You have a ModemReset option, if reset is "ATZ", ix will do that for you. It could be that if you had the reset string in the ModemInit position, ix might not be delaying here long enough before starting to send the dial string. Be sure you don't have this. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88666 16-JUL 16:32 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88634) From: DBREEDING To: CPERRAULT Chris, Just tried my own suggestion about putting modem reset code in for ModemInit. (see previous msg) What I saw was first the default ATZ I then saw my "atz", monemtary pause then "atz" again, on the same line, pause, then "Modem Error". I think what may be happening is that while the modem is resetting, ix has begun to send the dial code. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88669 16-JUL 17:40 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88666) From: MITHELEN To: DBREEDING are you seeing the "OK" returned after the ATZ is issued? -- Paul -*- 88678 17-JUL 14:51 Applications (6809) RE: Infoexpress Trouble (Re: Msg 88669) From: DBREEDING To: MITHELEN > are you seeing the "OK" returned after the ATZ is issued? (Note that I'm not the one having trouble, at least on this .) To review, as an experiment in trying to help someone (CPERRAULT?) I am in my editor now and can't check for sure who- find out why he couldn't get his modem to dial, I tried putting modem reset string (ATZ) in the ModemInit string. When attempting to go online, I would get this display ATZ <= from default init (ix) OK <= from proper "ATZ" atzatz <= from ModemInit string. You would get the first atz, a pause, then a retry, pause then "Modem error" As I said I suspect the atz was issued followed immediately by the dial string, and this was before the modem got reset so missed part of the dial string. No, there was no OK after the "artificial" atz's, suggesting maybe my theory is correct. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- End of Thread. -*- 88561 12-JUL 22:05 General Information database From: TMF To: ALL xD I am trying to see if there is any databases around that give a listing of software and / or hardware for OS9 . If there is please direct me to it if not then is there a need for one ? What I saw at one time was the OS9 source book , but it is severa l years out of date. What I would like to do if there is a need is to make something like "THE MAC WAREHOUSE" with access to all from the largest company to an individual with something to show. If anyone has any questions or comments leave message on DELP HI at TMF or 72701,543 on COMPUSERVE. I look forward to any and all comments from all. Tom Farrow -*- 88569 12-JUL 23:10 General Information PowerBoost/Nitro From: MMCCLELLAND To: ALL Can somebody please tell me the difference between the B&B PowerBoost and d Nitro? Are they the same thing? If they are copletely separate things, which s better? Thanks in advance for any help! -=Mark=- -*- 88574 12-JUL 23:46 General Information RE: PowerBoost/Nitro (Re: Msg 88569) From: MITHELEN To: MMCCLELLAND They are indead seperate things... The question as to which one is better, depends on how you look at it. They both try to accomplish the sam end goal (make the CoCo faster by running in 6309 native mode), but take very differant approaches... PowerBooster is very easy to install, and doesn't have problems patching already patched systems... Nitro gives better speed improvements, but the patches all need to be done to stock modules, and it tends to be much more dificult to get to install smoothly. (I have a friend that has been working for over a month trying to get a working Nitro boot, with no luck) -- Paul -*- 88575 12-JUL 23:46 General Information RE: PowerBoost/Nitro (Re: Msg 88569) From: WDTV5 To: MMCCLELLAND Well, first off, PB uses a routine thats in series with any interrupt, hardware or software, to reset the stack image presented to the rest of the system *back* to normal even tho the 6309 is actually running in the native mode. In this manner, no re-write of any module is required to make it run in the native mode environment. B&B's PB therefore can run all the original software written for the 6809. Nitros9 on the other hand, does not reset the stack image, therefore requireing often major re-writes of the system and other IRQ driven software before it will again run on the native mode 6309 systems. So the are advantages both ways. PB makes use of some of the native mode characeristics to get an approx %20 speedup with no other mods. One must also take into consideration the amount of time it takes to service an interrupt, such as the next incoming character from the modem. Since PB takes some of that time to reset the stack image, the IRQ "latency" must be a longer value or time than a system wherein the native mode stack image is written or re-written into the software/opsys. There are other tradeoffs I expect, but the loss of a character if the modem is spitting them out at 9600+ would happen a lot quicker with PB than with Nitros9. While I don't have any figures I can quote for direct comparison between PB and Nitros9, I can state that the IRQ latency as measured here on my Nitros9 system has been reduced by around 50% by the combination of the system re-write for the native mode operations as compared to a stock 6809/os9 level 2 machine. That translates into the limited ability to actually multitask with another program while captureing from this forum non-stop. Or to drive my printer on another job, its on a parallel port and doesn't requuire those timing loops the seriel port does. So you take your pick. I'm Nitros9 here, and its taken quite a while to get the rest of the programs modified to where they will run on this machine now. But I think I'm also faster. Apples/Oranges maybe, but thats how it seems to me. Cheers, Gene -*- 88577 13-JUL 00:06 General Information RE: PowerBoost/Nitro (Re: Msg 88574) From: MMCCLELLAND To: MITHELEN Thanks! I guess I will try PowerBoost (That is, if it is still available and I can figure out how to install it!). -=Mark=- -*- 88590 13-JUL 20:48 General Information RE: PowerBoost/Nitro (Re: Msg 88574) From: MIKE_GUZZI To: MITHELEN I had powerboost and switched to nitros. yes its more of a pain for nitors to install, but the speed difference is considerble. I could not get reliable 9600 baud with powerboost but i couldn't get it to enable native mode due to the patches for ribbs to allow non-os9 filenames. nitros is suited for this and the speedup is overall. i have no problems running programs with nitros. -*- End of Thread. -*- 88585 13-JUL 19:48 General Information RE: DynaCalc (Re: Msg 88418) From: MIKE_GUZZI To: ISC there are also people selling extra copies of dynacalc as well. I myself have about 5 spare copies of it and would be willing to sell them -*- 88608 14-JUL 21:36 General Information RE: DynaCalc (Re: Msg 88585) From: ISC To: MIKE_GUZZI Thanks for the info, Mike. I hope CLTUCKER was reading too! Bill -*- End of Thread. -*- 88591 13-JUL 20:51 System Modules (6809) Module fix? From: MIKE_GUZZI To: ALL I want to change my disk controller so its no longer in slot 4. Im running the sardis controller (sdisk 3) i think Sdisk3 has the slot number in it but are there any other system modules that change the multipak slot to 4?? all my other devices are fully decoded and do not use the SCS line. Mike -*- 88594 13-JUL 22:28 System Modules (6809) RE: Module fix? (Re: Msg 88591) From: RANDYKWILSON To: MIKE_GUZZI Mike, all RS232 drivers (sacia is easily configurable), and some hard drive drivers, such as B&B. I do not have a complete list. So, change Sdisk and SAcia, then try it. Access each device in turn, followed by the floppies. If the floppies quit, we missed one. :> Randy -*- 88623 15-JUL 18:04 System Modules (6809) RE: Module fix? (Re: Msg 88594) From: MIKE_GUZZI To: RANDYKWILSON Well my SACIA is configured for external IRQ (offset $14 in the module is the MPI slot, $FF means disable) so its probably just Sdisk3 since the SCSI drivers for my Ken-ton don't need SCS/CTS or any IRQ's Mike -*- End of Thread. -*- 88595 13-JUL 22:29 General Information Software From: MMCCLELLAND To: ALL Hi everybody! Can somebody _PLEASE_ tell me where I might find the following Burke & Burke products: -PowerBoost -The 6309 "developer's package" (A book by Chris Burke and patches for ASM) -A CoCo XT with RTC and auto boot ROM Also, who (if anybody) is currently marketing Nitro? Thanx! -=Mark=- -*- 88599 13-JUL 22:54 General Information RE: Software (Re: Msg 88595) From: MRUPGRADE To: MMCCLELLAND > Where can I get Burk & Burke.... Definately nmnot from Chris Burke. He leaf a post Via CI$ saying he moved,,, )though theh PO BOX still takes checks),, and hasn't filled oreders for months. CLosed til further notice. Sda but true. Sad but true. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- End of Thread. -*- 88597 13-JUL 22:36 Telecom (6809) unaccessable /h0 From: CHARLESAM To: MITHELEN Thanx Paul, I believe between you and DBreeding I got my answer. Now I have work to do. Let you know how I make out. Charlie -*- 88600 13-JUL 22:57 OSK Applications msg 88576 From: MRUPGRADE To: JOHNREED Sorry theh message 88598 I thought was going to Boisy. Til then,,, Terry Simons -*- 88605 14-JUL 18:48 General Information Printing From: PHILSCHERER To: JEJONES Hi James--Would you know how to list to a parallel printer in OS9000 or where in the manuals it tells how?? Any help appreciated! -*- 88620 15-JUL 03:48 General Information RE: Printing (Re: Msg 88605) From: JEJONES To: PHILSCHERER > Hi James--Would you know how to list to a parallel printer in OS9000 or > where in the manuals it tells how?? Any help appreciated! Maybe I don't understand the question. Check what SCF device drivers come with it, or better still, look for a device descriptor module named "p". If there is one, then things should work just like they do under OS-9, i.e. list woof.txt >/p ought to do just what you expect. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88622 15-JUL 05:14 General Information RE: Printing (Re: Msg 88605) From: EDELMAR To: PHILSCHERER Phil, The same command structure exists for OS-9000 as for OS-9 (well, mostly). You can use 'list >/p', 'pr >/p' , etc. Make sure the driver for 'p' is loaded. I have the following line in my 'startup' file - load -d /dd/ports/pcat/objs/p.lpt2 /dd/ports/pcat/objs/pcpll Ed Gresick - DELMAR CO -*- 88624 15-JUL 19:20 General Information RE: Printing (Re: Msg 88620) From: PHILSCHERER To: JEJONES Hi James--There are three descriptors available and I dont know which one is supposed to run the parallel printer. I didn't think that an SCF type driver was the one for a parallel output but if it is, I have four sc types to choose from. -*- 88625 15-JUL 19:23 General Information RE: Printing (Re: Msg 88622) From: PHILSCHERER To: EDELMAR Hi Ed--How did you know to pick p.lpt2 instead of 1 or 3 and how did you know to select pcpll as a driver?? Could you direct me to about where in the three manuals it is?? Thanks! -*- 88642 16-JUL 06:01 General Information RE: Printing (Re: Msg 88605) From: EDELMAR To: PHILSCHERER Phil, > How did you know to pick p.lpt2 instead of 1 or 3 and how did you know > to select pcpll as a driver?? Could you direct me to about where in the > three manuals it is?? Thanks! Well, it is a little convoluted to find what port to use. The manual doesn't cover this except they do list pcpll as the parallel printer driver - see page B-6 in the section entitled 'PC/OS-9000 INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS'. Also, if you do a dump of one of the three descriptors, you'll see pcpll listed - looks like ....'scf.pcpll'.. . Finding out which descriptor to use can be a little more complicated. If you know which ltp(n) you're using, you may be OK. If you're not, you have several methods at you're disposal to find out. The first is the table displayed (AMIBIOS System Configuration) when you boot the system. Mine shows the parallel port at '378'. The second is to use debug under MSDOS. At the debug prompt '-' enter the following - 'd 40:0 f'. This will give you the addresses of the serial and parallel ports in use. The first 8 byte entries are the serial ports and the last 8 are for the parallel ports; LPT1, LPT2, LPT3 and LPT4 respectively. The entries work in pairs. On my machine, entries 8 and 9 are '78' and '03' respectively. There are no other entries after this. (Remember, byte ordering for Intel chips is backwards.) So my parallel (LPT) port is '378' and since it is the first entry, MS-DOS calls it LPT1. Alternatively, I believe Norton's utilites (and some of the others) will show the proper address(s). OK, now we know the address of the port. We don't care what MS-DOS calls it. Go to OS-9000. Change directories to 'ports/pcat' and list the 'systype.h' file. Go down a couple of screens and you'll find some '#ifdef's for LPT1, LPT2 and LPT3. These show the addresses for the respective ports - they're called 'PBASE'. Select the LPT(n) that corresponds with the address you found above. BTW, according to the books I have on MSDOS, MW's addresses and port designations are correct - not sure about some of the MS-DOS hardware suppliers, though. Ed Gresick - DELMAR CO -*- 88643 16-JUL 07:49 General Information RE: Printing (Re: Msg 88642) From: PHILSCHERER To: EDELMAR Ed--That sure is a nice explanation for the ports. Maybe you can work part time for Microware as the tecnical and manual writer. They will certainly need some docs more user friendly as OS9K increases its user base. Thanks! -*- End of Thread. -*- 88610 14-JUL 22:21 Applications (6809) PcDos Program From: JMICHELSON To: ALL Has anyone ever experienced any problems using the PcDos program in moving large files? I'm trying to move a 389K file from my 720k /d1 and the program works fine on about 1/2 the file and then aborts by saying "ERROR: Read Failed". I checked the disk on my pc and the .zip file tests fine and I'm able to move it back and forth on the pc. The command I'm using is: pcdos -get -raw /d1 filename.zip /h1/temp/filename.zip I've used PcDos many times before and have not run into this problem before. I don't recall trying to move something this large though, and was wondering if there is some limitation of the file size that can be moved. Any ideas will be appreciated. -*- 88655 16-JUL 13:35 Applications (6809) RE: PcDos Program (Re: Msg 88610) From: DBREEDING To: JMICHELSON > Has anyone ever experienced any problems using the PcDos program in > moving large files? I'm trying to move a 389K file from my 720k /d1 and > > wondering if there is some limitation of the file size that can be moved. > Any ideas will be appreciated. Do you have the latest version ? Version 4? Earlier versions *DID* have this problem. I think most of them just quietly quit, though, I think. Don't know if there is a limit for version 4, but this was one of the fixes in it. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88696 18-JUL 03:18 Applications (6809) RE: PcDos Program (Re: Msg 88655) From: JMICHELSON To: DBREEDING I have the latest version of PCDOS, but I believe my CC3Disk driver is one of the older ones (MDALENE mentioned that may the problem I believe). I will check the database here on Delphi for a newer CC3Disk, but if it is not here, could someone upload it? Thanks for all the help. -*- End of Thread. -*- 88612 15-JUL 01:46 Programmers Den mm/1 screen From: LARRYOLSON To: ALL Could someone tell me how to get the pixel data from an MM/1 kwindow screen ? The C routine that I have been trying, is either wrong or I'm not up on how the data is stored in memory. For the test, I open a type 3 320x208 256 color window. Then using SetDPtr I set the pointer location to 4,0 then I draw a line from there too 4,15. Now what throws me is, that this type window should use 8 bits per pixel, which means that if I get the screen start address using _gs_scinfo, and print out the first dozen or so bytes, all the bytes should be the same(screen is cleared), except the 5th byte, but when the test is run, it is the 3rd byte that is changed. Trying different locations: screen x location byte changed 5 3rd 6 4th 7 4th 8 5th This appears to me to be 4 bits per pixel, where are the other 4 bits ? I am opening a window as a type 3, with the following: Wpath2 = open("/w",3); DWSet(Wpath2, 3, 0, 0, 40, 26, 255, 1, 1); and getting the screen info with: _gs_scinfo(Wpath2, &sc); This has me stumped larry ----- Larry Olson ----- -*- 88626 15-JUL 19:51 Programmers Den RE: mm/1 screen (Re: Msg 88612) From: COLORSYSTEMS To: LARRYOLSON Isn't there a function in the cgfx.l which returns the palette slot of a point on the screen? ------------------------------------ Zack C Sessions They say, "Money talks". But all mine ever says is, "Goodbye". -*- 88636 16-JUL 01:14 Programmers Den RE: mm/1 screen (Re: Msg 88626) From: LARRYOLSON To: COLORSYSTEMS > Isn't there a function in the cgfx.l which returns the palette slot of a > point on the screen? Zack, Yes, there is, _gs_palette will return palette register values, and no doubt I will be using _gs_palette to get the rgb color values, as I'm attempting to write some kind of screen print program that I can use with this hp550c printer. At this point I'm not bothering with the color values, I'm just trying to print out the pixel values, and with a 256 color screen, each pixel would need 8 bits, but for some reason the pixels appear to be using only 4 bits. larry ----- Larry Olson ----- -*- 88665 16-JUL 15:56 Programmers Den RE: mm/1 screen (Re: Msg 88636) From: COLORSYSTEMS To: LARRYOLSON > > Isn't there a function in the cgfx.l which returns the palette slot of a > > point on the screen? > > Yes, there is, _gs_palette will return palette register values, and no I'm not talking about _gs_palette, I am talking about _gs_point(). ------------------------------------ Zack C Sessions They say, "Money talks". But all mine ever says is, "Goodbye". -*- 88668 16-JUL 17:02 Programmers Den RE: mm/1 screen (Re: Msg 88612) From: JOELHEGBERG To: LARRYOLSON Larry, > Could someone tell me how to get the pixel data from an MM/1 kwindow > screen ? Usually, you use color=_gs_point(path,x,y); > For the test, I open a type 3 320x208 256 color window. Then using > SetDPtr I set the pointer location to 4,0 then I draw a line from there > too 4,15. Now what throws me is, that this type window should use 8 bits > per pixel, which means that if I get the screen start address using > _gs_scinfo, and print Everything looks good, and the type 3 screen does in fact use a full byte for each pixel. I would bet that graphics scaling is what's confusing your test results. Try turning off graphics scaling using ScaleSw(wpath,0); and see if your results come into line (no pun intended). ;) ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- End of Thread. -*- 88613 15-JUL 02:37 General Information help From: ROBERT84 To: ALL Help, I just got infoxpress (coco version) and I'm trying to figure out what text editor I can use instead of the old tandy editor. Can someone help me out. I tried to use Ted but infoxpress would not let me use it. I would appreciate any help that I can get. Thanks, Bob -*- 88614 15-JUL 02:37 General Information help From: ROBERT84 To: ALL Help, I just got my infoxpress up and running (coco version) but I have one real bad problem. What editor can I use besides the tandy edit. I tried using ted but infoxpress (or something I did) wouldn't let it work. So does anyone have a better way to do it. I would really appreciate the help. Thanks, Bob Delphi: Robert84 Internet: Robert84@Delphi.com STG: Sysop@TheRock -*- 88615 15-JUL 02:38 General Information help (again) From: ROBERT84 To: ALL One more problem for you infoxpress users. Is it possible to access other forums here. I don't have a problem with SIG forums. But I have tried to get into some custom forums and the program hangs up at the propmt for the forum menu. It requires a carriage return (I guess) to get to the menu. I did try but all that happen was when I got to the return for custom forum menu (say 1) the computer locked up. Delphi: Robert84 Internet: Robert84@Delphi.com STG: Sysop@TheRock -*- 88698 18-JUL 03:46 General Information RE: help (again) (Re: Msg 88615) From: JEVESTAL To: ROBERT84 (NR) > One more problem for you infoxpress users. Is it possible to access > other forums here. I don't have a problem with SIG forums. But I have > tried to get into some custom forums and the program hangs up at the > propmt for the forum menu. It requires a carriage return (I guess) to > get to the menu. I did try but all that happen was when I got to the > return for custom forum menu (say 1) the computer locked up. I had the same problems accessing the custum forums. To access the custume forums use the following line in the delphi.ini file: GoWord = gro cus 17 substitute the 17 with the number of the custum forum that you want to access. Jim ======================== InfoXpress 01.01.00 OS-9/6809 ====================== | Narnia BBS: 11pm-7am PDT serving CoCo OS-9 users ----|---- StG network: sysop@Narnia "Exclusively OS-9" | Delphi: JEVestal@delphi.com Marysville, CA InterNet: JEVestal@narnia.wa.com | or : JEVestal@citrus.sac.ca.us (916) 743-2617 Voice: 7am-11pm PDT :1 Corinthians 1:18 & Romans 1:16 ============================================================================= Jim Vestal: Assistant editor of The International OS-9 Underground, "Magazine dedicated to OS-9/OSK Users Everywhere -*- End of Thread. -*- 88616 15-JUL 03:02 Telecom (6809) RE: VT100 (Re: Msg 88324) From: BROWN80 To: SES (NR) If you are looking for just a VT-100 simulator that runs on a CoCo3 under OS-9 there is an excelent one in the database. It is a short simple program and I no problem downloading it. Included is a script file for setting up a screen and calling the program and three pages of documentation that are almost un- necessary. This is just a terminal simulator. You even have to escape to a shell to download. The name of the program I think is appropriately "VT-100" by Brian Marcotte. John Brown -*- 88618 15-JUL 03:02 General Information RE: OS-9 fest in Dallas? (Re: Msg 88399) From: BROWN80 To: NIMITZ OS-9 show in Dallas? I know I would attend. I'm from Bryan and if there is something I can help with, I would be glad to. My time is limited but any leftovers would be gladly be donated to the cause. John Brown -*- 88652 16-JUL 12:14 General Information RE: OS-9 fest in Dallas? (Re: Msg 88618) From: NIMITZ To: BROWN80 John, our current 'local contact' is Allen Huffan who can be reached at coco-sysop@genie.com via internet. We need suggestions and pricing on hotels and convention centers. I'm looking for a place with professional presentation support, so I can make some overhead projector transparencies and that sort of thing. David -*- End of Thread. -*- 88621 15-JUL 03:52 System Modules (6809) Smartwatch / Ken-ton Clock From: BILL32H To: ALL Help !!! Somebody how dose one change the base address of the smartwatch to say FF70 , or were can I get a ST MK48T02-20 Clock chip I've tryed the mk48Z02b it don't work. BILL32H -*- 88629 15-JUL 21:09 System Modules (6809) RE: PIA (Re: Msg 88477) From: MARTYGOODMAN To: DONALDS Keyboard problems can be caused by a bad PIA chip, or by bad contacts on the ribbon cable, or by a damaged ribbon cable, or by bad key switches in the keyboard. MOST of the time when a SINGLE key fails, it's the fault of a bad key switch. Your tale of the switch getting better when someone pushes it repeatedly is also consistent with a failing key switch that gets a bit better, perhaps only temporarilly, with exercise. A broken or intermittent trace on the ribbon cable or contact, or a blown single pin line on the PIA, would cause an entire ROW or COLUMN of keys (in the electrical matrix) to go dead, not a single key. ---marty -*- 88710 19-JUL 08:03 System Modules (6809) RE: PIA (Re: Msg 88629) From: DONALDS To: MARTYGOODMAN Thanks for the info Marty. That sounds better than trying to replace the chip. Don -*- End of Thread. -*- 88631 15-JUL 21:19 General Information source book From: TMF To: ALL Hi guys!!!!! Do you guys want to help in putting together a source book for OS9 I will put together in,some form, and make it available for all. Needless to say it will be open for all to contribute to. The more you send the larger the selection for all. Thanks in advance for all the help. If there is something out there that already exists then let me know. TMF delphi 72701,543 CIS -*- 88641 16-JUL 05:14 General Information RE: source book (Re: Msg 88631) From: JEJONES To: TMF > If there is something out there that already exists then let me know. Hiya! That is a noble effort. Microware put out two editions of *The OS-9 Sourcebook*, but it's been some years since the second one came out, so that IMHO we need a new reference of this sort. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88657 16-JUL 14:15 General Information RE: source book (Re: Msg 88641) From: TMF To: JEJONES Thank you for your opinion and I realize that this is an undertaking of biblical proportion , but with everyone helping I should be able to do it. Any and all help is greatly appreciated. TMF -*- 88702 18-JUL 20:57 General Information RE: source book (Re: Msg 88657) From: DSRTFOX To: TMF I have a suggestion: divide the book into two sections at least, or more likely two volumes: one for OS-9/6809, the other for OS-9/68000. I have a small business involved in publishing, so contact me if we can work some printing/publishing details out. (in e-mail) I'm pretty fair in pricing and making deals, so we should be able to easily work something out!! -*- 88714 19-JUL 21:49 General Information RE: source book (Re: Msg 88702) From: TMF To: DSRTFOX (NR) This sounds like a great idea so far you are the only response I have had , but I sent out several letters . We will see what happens. Thanks for the help. TMF -*- End of Thread. -*- 88638 16-JUL 02:05 General Information OS-9 Floppy Structure From: JMURPHY To: ALL I've been going over the Level 2 Tech Ref and have a few Q's about Disk structure: DD.TKS and DD.SPT: Two places to specify the same value ? DD.DSK, DD.FMT, DD.OPT: Undocumented ? What are valid values for these variables? If this is spelled out somewhere, feel free to simply quote page numbers, etc. Thanks in advance, John Murphy -*- 88640 16-JUL 03:41 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88638) From: MITHELEN To: JMURPHY Yes, except, DD.SPT is a two byte value. DD.DSK = Disk ID DD.FMT = Disk format DD.OPT = Path Descriptor Options. I got this info from the OS-9/68000 v2.3 manual... sorry, don't have a Level 2 manual anymore... -*- 88656 16-JUL 13:55 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88640) From: JMURPHY To: MITHELEN Thanks for the response. >DD.DSK = Disk ID >DD.FMT = Disk format >DD.OPT = Path Descriptor Options. The Rad Shack manual ALSO clearly states the above, but it doesn't go into ANY detail (that I have found) on what these values are, what they are used for, or anything of that nature. If anyone can help clear this up, or point me towards an online document here or elsewhere that fills in the gaps in the RS Tech ref, I would appreciate it. Thanks to everyone in advance. John Murphy -*- 88662 16-JUL 15:48 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88638) From: DBREEDING To: JMURPHY DD.FMT is described on page 5-16 in Tech Ref. I think someone else answered the rest of your questions. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88667 16-JUL 16:42 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88662) From: JMURPHY To: DBREEDING David, Thanks for the pointer: DD.FMT is defined on page 5-16 of the Tech ref and it says (roughly): Bit0 = Number of sides 0=ss 1=ds Bit1 = Density 0=sd 1=dd Bit2 = Track Density 0=48tpi 1=96tpi I still don't know the difference between DD.TKS and DD.SPT other than the fact that DD.TKS is a single byte and DD.SPT is a word. Why two different places for the same value? I am _assuming_ that the only value I will see on a stock CoCo is 18 for both. Is this a safe assumption ? I also don't know what legal values are for DD.DSK. The only reference in the tech ref that I found is on page 5-2 and it says (roughly): DD.DSK ( Disk identification) is two bytes and is for internal use. If I change that value, will OS-9 choke? What is the valid range of values ? Is it used as a serial number, filled with random data, or based on date and time the disk was created? DD.OPT : The manual is fairly mute: It starts at offest $3f, but no length or size information is in the table on page 5-2. Is DD.OPT related to PD.OPT which is described on page 5-7? I realize these are a lot of questions, and that they are are mostly academic since the OS normally handles access to these values, but I am trying to do file access using strictly RAW access to the floppy, including (but not limited to) filling in these values from scratch. Thanks, I appreciate the help. Keep it coming! Thanks to everyone in advance for any further comments, amplifications. John Murphy -*- 88675 17-JUL 14:49 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88667) From: DBREEDING To: JMURPHY > I still don't know the difference between DD.TKS and DD.SPT other than > the fact that DD.TKS is a single byte and DD.SPT is a word. Why two > different places for the same value? I am _assuming_ that the only value I > will see on a stock CoCo is 18 for both. Is this a safe assumption ? Not sure about it. Didn't ever get into this very deeply, so can't say. > I also don't know what legal values are for DD.DSK. The only reference in > the tech ref that I found is on page 5-2 and it says (roughly): > > DD.DSK ( Disk identification) is two bytes and is for internal use. The purpose of this is to detect disk changes. When the disk is formatted, the system generates a pseudo-random # for this value. Think it takes the date-time and juggles it around. Saw it somewhere, can't remember where. Not sure if OS9 Lvl 2 supports it or not, but it can check this ID # and get a pretty safe "guess" whether the disk has been changed or not. > If I change that value, will OS-9 choke? What is the valid range of values ? -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88737 21-JUL 01:38 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88656) From: WILLFO To: JMURPHY Seems I read somewhere that DD.DSK is a pseudo-ra pseudo-random number which format writes to the disk. I've checked and this number IS different with each formatting. It is supposed to be used by applications programs to detect if the disk has been swapped. I can't remember where I read this information. regards, WILLFO -*- 88743 21-JUL 22:17 General Information RE: OS-9 Floppy Structure (Re: Msg 88737) From: JMURPHY To: WILLFO (NR) WILLFO, >I read somewhere DD.DSK is a pseudo random number Sounds good to me so far. I'll try just shoving a random number into that field and see if anything blows up. Sometimes trial and error is the best way to go... Thanks, John Murphy -*- End of Thread. -*- 88645 16-JUL 11:27 General Information hard drive controller From: SAUSAGESAM To: ALL Does anybody have a hard drive controller for the CoCo that they could sell me pretty cheaply? thanks. -*- 88658 16-JUL 14:30 General Information RE: hard drive controller (Re: Msg 88645) From: MMCCLELLAND To: SAUSAGESAM Check the classified ads here. I think there was an Eliminator or a CoCo-XT advertised there. -*- End of Thread. -*- 88647 16-JUL 11:44 General Information From: SAUSAGESAM To: ALL Is there anything out there that will convert TGA files to GIF? I just downloaded a program that will convert 3 screen .PIX files to TGA but now I need one from TGA to GIF..... -*- 88653 16-JUL 12:44 General Information ANSI Codes needed From: BOISY To: ALL Hi folks, I am in need of a document which contains the ANSI emulation specification, as well as ANSI color codes. If anyone has this document, would they be so kind as to mail it to my account here? Thanks. -*- 88659 16-JUL 14:43 General Information MM/1 From: MMCCLELLAND To: NIMITZ Are you still selling MM/1's? I might be interested in buying one. How much would one cost that has a case, the I/O board, and all of the software? What other OSK products are you selling? Thanks in advance! -=Mark=- -*- 88670 16-JUL 22:51 System Modules (6809) OSK Software From: WDTV5 To: NIMITZ David; I can't resist making a comment regarding the "50" varieties of COCO-OS9 L2 right now. While there may be a valid argument that each of us has "customized" the system such that it now does "what we want it to do", I would also argue that the "customizations" were brought about in nearly every case because we wanted it to do something that the MicroWare's original vision discounted as "not important enough to waste a variable on". And please Boisy, don't take offense as much of this thinking probably pre-dates your involvement. I refer you to such things as the hard-coding of many things that we had to dig into and find later (or sooner in many cases) because they really were important enough to "waste a variable" on. The original release cc3disk comes to mind for starters. All the (relatively simple) patches required to make the C compiler actually run were another. Same comment applies to the Pascal too. Then comes Multiview, DeskMate I & II, DynaCalc, Profile. All of these, WITHOUT EXCEPTION needed massageing in one form or another. I won't belabor the point on DM I or II, nor send it flowers in memory of its early demise. Multiview of course has had its main module "gshell" redone several times along with grfdrv. DynaCalc yet needs some way to really control how it treats the printer instead of all these patches to get rid of the spurious form feed. It really wasn't spurious if the last job left it sitting in mid page, but *nobody* thought of that. The real cure was to have the printer ignore the darn thing IF it was allready sitting at pagetop. Not many printers are that smart tho. A one byte var could have taken care of that in DCalc. Profile as I recall needed something done too, but I don't at the moment recall what it was, I did it so many years back. And yes, I still use it on a semi-stock L2 system at the station. The C & Pascal compilers, DynaCalc and Profile were all originally L1 and they required patches NOT to make them run on level 2, but to make them run on the average system which didn't quite match the bare minimum system used as a hardware model. Hard-codeing things like the devicename was/is pretty inexcusable. I hear somebody saying "but we didn't have /dd then", which is pure hog-wash! The idea was just as valid on a level one system. WE just hadn't thought of it YET. (Pulling out soapbox) The last point I'd like to make refers to the other comments in this thread regarding gfx drivers.. If the machine can support the graphics that apparently the MM/1 can, then the graphics drivers ARE PART AND PARCEL of the op-sys AS SHIPPED! The fact that you would have to raise the price of the package by some nominal sum (I saw $50 mentioned) has absolutely nothing to do with it in terms of "a marketing decision" because *then* you are shipping a system capable of running the application regardless of what that application might be. The application will then be written to "your" standard. And thats worth far more in the long run than any $50 you might "save" in the short term. Later "for fee" upgrades then will build on that standard as they will be forced to remain "compatible" unless the distribution version is so buggy it really does need thrown out . . . Nobody enjoys re-inventing the wheel unless the first model was square or ? It also has the effect of setting a short-term "standard" way of doing things thereby enhancing right up front, the "compatiblility" issue we now have in the L2 arena because so many of us have gone on to the Hitachi CPU in the native mode. The PB folks have the ability to "run what they brung" while the slightly faster Nitros9 group had to wait for a patched "Home Publisher". Not many of us chewed any fingernails waiting for it but now we have it again. (And its *still* painfully slow) The point is that if we would have had a Multiview that actually worked shipped WITH the OS-9 distribution, I think the playing field between us and the Intel crowd would have been much closer to level. The folks in Westchester might have turned up the heat a bit faster too. (Commie Amiga's) We've also wasted entirely too much time on the BLOB. This has to be a hardware thing, probably in the GIME. That it should never have seen light outside outside the back door of 1 Tandy Center is a given! I have personally written letters to the people whom I thought could answer questions like "How much for another run of 5000" and "are the databases to define it available so the bugs can be fixed?". Nobody took the time or the postage to reply. Had my letters been answered, you can bet yours that I would have been on here asking for donations to help offset the "OTE" costs involved. Obviously I haven't. So I wasted a page on your printer. But thats how it seems to me. Cheers - Gene -*- 88679 17-JUL 14:52 System Modules (6809) RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88670) From: DBREEDING To: WDTV5 > David; > > I can't resist making a comment regarding the "50" varieties of > COCO-OS9 L2 right now. While there may be a valid argument that each of us > has "customized" the system such that it now does "what we want it to do" I think each and every patch was an improvement. However, I think the point is that it has introduced an element of compatibility. None are that big, as soon as you recognize them. The most notable thing has bee the thing with shell+ allocating a minimum of 8K data storage. A few programs - ix, the new ar using 13-bit compression, UMuse(I think), barf on this. Again, it's not a big problem, as long as you recognize it. I still wouldn't go back to a stock system for love or money. > The last point I'd like to make refers to the other comments in this > thread regarding gfx drivers.. If the machine can support the graphics > that apparently the MM/1 can, then the graphics drivers ARE PART AND > PARCEL of the op-sys AS SHIPPED! I agree here, at least almost totally. This seems logical, as I said in a previous post. Of course the marketing decision is up to the mfgrs., but I do think this would be the way to go. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88686 17-JUL 22:02 System Modules (6809) RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88679) From: WDTV5 To: DBREEDING Gee, I'd like just once to have something happen here that would confirm all this stuff I hear about shell+ needing a min of 8k. The patches to fix that were avaiable, almost the next day! I did 'em once and promptly forgot about it and have never had any problems with it. There are/were a couple of progs that I edited the size request in, like asm, mine has been asking for 16k since '86 or so. Other than a couple of items like that, its a non-problem. The point is that the fix is available, and as far as I know, right here in the databse. The marketing methods used are usually designed to maximize profits, never miind that it might work a hell of a lot better our way. And, I contend, would be more profitable in the long view by a factor of at least 2! But bean counters don't really want to recognize that there are various quality's of beans avaviable(available) and unless the populace is starving, will always pay 5% more for a better quality bean. Oh, well. . . Cheers - Gene -*- 88740 21-JUL 20:33 System Modules (6809) RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88686) From: DBREEDING To: WDTV5 > Gee, I'd like just once to have something happen here that would confirm > all this stuff I hear about shell+ needing a min of 8k. The patches to > fix that were avaiable, almost the next day! > a couple of progs that I edited the size request in, like asm, mine has > been asking for 16k since '86 or so. Other than a couple of items like > that, its a non-problem. The point is that the fix is available, and as > far as I know, right here in the databse. I have the patch, just figured there was a need for 8k. Seems I saw something to the effect that if the data is not large enough, it will barf or crash on wildcarding sometimes. The progs that barf with shell+, I have renamed the stock shell "ohell" and call the progs from it. Might go ahead and patch shell+. Yeah, I went ahead and edited *my* asm, too. I bumped it up to 20k. However, I still feel that we have gotten a little divergence with the CoCo - especially with the advent of the 6309. Personally I would love to have *EVERYTHING* set up for the 6309. That's system and run-time progs both. I think a whole bunch of features could have been implemented. The C compiler could be completely redesigned. The latest version of the C compiler ( never released to us ) passed the first variable to the called function in the D register. With the 6309, 2 could be passed (W), or a long or float could be passed without stacking. There are lots of ways to fix things up, but this would require almost everyone making a standard switch, and it would be just too much to ask. -- David Breeding -- CompuServe : 72330,2051 Delphi : DBREEDING *** Sent via CoCo-InfoXpress V1.01 *** ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ -*- 88742 21-JUL 22:03 System Modules (6809) RE: OSK Software (Re: Msg 88740) From: WDTV5 To: DBREEDING (NR) I'm afraid I have to agree regarding the inability to do a "standard" switch. We as a group have prooved (sp) one thing if nothing else, and thats that we are individuals as a group, much more so than the pc'rers IMHO. They tend to be bound to the limitations as if a workround was against some moral law or something. We don't seem to work that way! When we see a problem or something on some other machine that would be nice to have, it seems that availability of the "oterh guys", darn "other" source doesn't seem to stop us. If its worth doing, we just go do it! At least thats been my approach on more than one occassion. And yes, I'll have to plead guilty to useing some of us as unwitting alpha testers, not because I intended it to be that way, but because I'm no more infallible than anybody else who isn't doing this for a living. On balance, I'd like to think I've contributed a positive effect, but thats pure ego too. Like you, I'd like to see one cpu again so that we could have a bit more compatibility, and just because I'm a 6309'er, I'd like to see that as the standard. But then we still have 2 competing, non- compatible 6309 conversions on the opsys. Unforch, neither of the folks who brought it to life have stuck around to put the "spit and polish" on it, at least not visible here on what I think is the best coco/os9 gathering place ever. I understand that there is a release of Nitros9 to 1.20 coming up. Now what we need to do is see if we can come up with some benchmarks that are real to us, not something borrowed from the pc'ers and which doesn'T really have much to do with us. Once a real suite of tests and the results are known, then just maybe, we might all migrate to the same opsys again. Hopefull said, but not going to hold any breathing up till it happens. Cheers - Gene -*- End of Thread. -*- 88673 17-JUL 00:06 OSK Applications RE: zmodem crash recovery (Re: Msg 88432) From: JEVESTAL To: MITHELEN > Right Joel... It is the newer releases of rz/sz that have no way of > switching on recovery from the receiveing end. The OS-9 version of > RZ/SZ strictly conform to the official Omen release of the rz/sz Zmodem > sources, because they use the official sources. I imagine your Mac > software is usining its own interpetation of the zmodem description. > Perhaps in a future release I do for OS-9, I will set zmodem receive > (rz) up so crash recovery is normally switched on, or, add the extra > coimmand line option to turn it on... this would solve the "problem". Paul, please do such a hack to rz.... it would solve alot of problems, since Delphi's transfers bomb alot. MS-DOS users think I'm crazy when I say that Delphi doesn't support crash recovery since their zmodems allow them to recover with no problems. Can you post a message to the Internet forum and the to Future forum explaining why Delphi doesn't support recovery? Jim ======================== InfoXpress 01.01.00 OS-9/6809 ====================== | Narnia BBS: 11pm-7am PDT serving CoCo OS-9 users ----|---- StG network: sysop@Narnia "Exclusively OS-9" | Delphi: JEVestal@delphi.com Marysville, CA InterNet: JEVestal@narnia.wa.com | or : JEVestal@citrus.sac.ca.us (916) 743-2617 Voice: 7am-11pm PDT :1 Corinthians 1:18 & Romans 1:16 ============================================================================= Jim Vestal: Assistant editor of The International OS-9 Underground, "Magazine dedicated to OS-9/OSK Users Everywhere -*- 88681 17-JUL 15:45 Programmers Den RE: Pixel_Blaster (Re: Msg 86835) From: TOMFANN To: DSRTFOX I'm reading this thread about Pixel Blaster for the first time in July. I remember seeing it in CoCoPRO's flyers, but never shelled out the cash because I didn't know anything about it. How about a review? I'm interested! ..Tom Fann -*- 88684 17-JUL 21:02 OSK Applications syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 From: VAXELF To: ALL Can someone send me a sample program that uses the "syscall" routine for OSK Basic V2.4 . I have some Basic09 programs that use syscall and want to convert them to OSK. John D. -*- 88692 18-JUL 00:18 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88684) From: RANDYKWILSON To: VAXELF John, You set up the stack image differently: TYPE reg=d0,d1,d2,d3,d4,d5,d6,d7,a0,a1,a2,a3,a4:INTEGER DIM r1 {,r2,r3,etc} : reg From there, you'll need to change what values get stuffed into what reg, and sometimes what the code does, do to the differences in CPU and reg sizes. This pretty much has to be done on a call by call basis. Randy -*- 88700 18-JUL 20:12 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88692) From: VAXELF To: RANDYKWILSON Thanks for the reply. I will see what I can do now. BTW, any thought on the syntax for MW Basic Inkey. From experimentation. I found that the format is something like: DIM char:STRING[1] char= INKEY(#1) The problem is now it gives a error 71 and doesn't compile or run. John A. Donaldson -*- 88701 18-JUL 20:56 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88700) From: JOELHEGBERG To: VAXELF John, > Thanks for the reply. I will see what I can do now. > BTW, any thought on the syntax for MW Basic Inkey. From experimentation. > I found that the format is something like: > > DIM char:STRING[1] > > char= INKEY(#1) > > The problem is now it gives a error 71 and doesn't compile or run. INKEY for Basic/00 is different than in Basic/09... it returns the number of characters in the input buffer (I suppose it's just like a _gs_rdy() in C). So, it doesn't actually get the character for you. Do something like: DIM numchars:INTEGER DIM keypress:STRING[1] 100 numchars=INKEY(#0) if numchars<1 then 100 get #0,keypress WARNING: I haven't written in MW Basic in a very long time, so the above code may not be syntactically correct, but you get the picture. :) ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88709 19-JUL 07:27 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88701) From: JEJONES To: JOELHEGBERG > INKEY for Basic/00 is different than in Basic/09... it returns the > number of characters in the input buffer (I suppose it's just like a > _gs_rdy() in C). So, it doesn't actually get the character for you. Do > something like: > > DIM numchars:INTEGER > DIM keypress:STRING[1] > > 100 numchars=INKEY(#0) > if numchars<1 then 100 > get #0,keypress > > WARNING: I haven't written in MW Basic in a very long time, so the above > code may not be syntactically correct, but you get the picture. :) It's syntactically correct, but... 1. BASIC09/Microware BASIC will let you do better than that! REPEAT numchars:=INKEY(0) UNTIL numchars>0 GET #0,keypress 2. Over and above control flow questions, it's not nice on a multitasking operating system to do a "busy wait" loop like that--it hogs the system waiting for what's probably a SLLLOOWWWW human to press a key. Consider LOOP numchars:=INKEY(0) EXITIF numchars>0 THEN ENDEXIT RUN bgfx("sleep", 1) ENDLOOP GET #0,keypress as an alternative that other processes will thank you for. To be even more considerate, using the SS_SSIG setstat, takes some more work. Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88712 19-JUL 21:08 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88701) From: VAXELF To: JOELHEGBERG Thanks Joel, I'll let you know later what I am upto. It may be of interest. BTW any thoughs on adding more fonts to Write-Right??? Could rally use scalable fonts too. Then you could do some desk-top-publishing type stuff. John D. -*- 88713 19-JUL 21:11 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88709) From: VAXELF To: JEJONES since I was the orginator of the subject, THANKS. John D. -*- 88718 20-JUL 03:48 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88712) From: JOELHEGBERG To: VAXELF John, > I'll let you know later what I am upto. It may be of interest. Great! > BTW any thoughs on adding more fonts to Write-Right??? Could rally use > scalable fonts too. Then you could do some desk-top-publishing type > stuff. I don't have any interest in getting into graphical modes of word processing at present, mainly due to the diversity of printer graphics protocols/codes out there! ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88732 20-JUL 21:35 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88684) From: HAWKSOFT To: VAXELF Like this: PROCEDURE getid REM getid of os9 version TYPE registers=dat(8),add(5):INTEGER DIM regs:registers DIM callcode:INTEGER DIM info,copy,author:STRING[80] callcode:=$55 regs.dat(1):=0 regs.add(1):=ADDR(info) regs.add(2):=ADDR(copy) regs.add(3):=ADDR(author) RUN syscall(callcode,regs) PRINT info PRINT copy PRINT author PRINT regs.dat(1) PRINT regs.dat(2) PRINT regs.dat(3) PRINT regs.dat(4) Chris :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88734 20-JUL 23:09 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88718) From: MRGOOD To: JOELHEGBERG I for one would like to see much better printer control in Write-Right. Support for proportional fonts would be ideal. Hugo -*- 88748 22-JUL 01:17 OSK Applications RE: syscall for OSK Basic V2.4 (Re: Msg 88734) From: JOELHEGBERG To: MRGOOD (NR) I have put some more thought into proportional fonts lately... it's a possibility. I'm working on getting some other features in first, like a spell checker. PS, I'm going on vacation until Monday, so expect no replies until then. :) -- Joel. -*- End of Thread. -*- 88685 17-JUL 21:50 General Information AHHHHI Need help From: SAUSAGESAM To: ALL Uh.. Whenever I try to boot OS9 and type DOS, it is just always saying OK and not saying OS9 BOOT! I think it's a problem with the multi-pak not making connection properly with the coco slot but I dont know. Does anybody have any help? thanks -*- 88690 18-JUL 00:05 General Information RE: AHHHHI Need help (Re: Msg 88685) From: MITHELEN To: SAUSAGESAM Sounds more like you are trying to boot a non-bootable disk. Have you tried plugging the disk controller directly into the CoCo and booting the same disk to verify that the disk is indeed bootable? -- Paul -*- 88693 18-JUL 01:01 General Information RE: AHHHHI Need help (Re: Msg 88690) From: SAUSAGESAM To: MITHELEN yeah.. i tried that and it boots fine.. It's happened before, it7s like the isn't making good contact with the computer.. Because when I have the problems booting OS9 I also have problems getting some machine language programs to work.. -*- End of Thread. -*- 88695 18-JUL 03:15 General Information GIF/VEF From: REVWCP To: ALL Dear friends: I am in the process of doing some housekeeping on my harddrive. I have a large amount of VEF and GIF files and I was wondering, what is the best archive utility to use on these files? Which, AR...LZH..., etc. will create the smallest file? With all best wishes, Brother Jeremy, CSJW OS9 User's Group Treasurer -*- 88699 18-JUL 20:10 General Information RE: GIF/VEF (Re: Msg 88695) From: COLORSYSTEMS To: REVWCP > I am in the process of doing some housekeeping on my harddrive. I have > a large amount of VEF and GIF files and I was wondering, what is the > best archive utility to use on these files? Which, AR...LZH..., etc. > will create the smallest file? You can compress VEF with most anything, but the archivers which work better on binary files for input like lzh format is best. GIF on the other hand is already compressed using the same compression algorithm lzh uses. So, you can archive them, but you will find that most of the time the archived version of the file is actually larger than the original file! ------------------------------------ Zack C Sessions They say, "Money talks". But all mine ever says is, "Goodbye". -*- 88704 18-JUL 22:16 General Information RE: GIF/VEF (Re: Msg 88695) From: JOHNBAER To: REVWCP Brother Jeremy, > ... I have a large amount of VEF and GIF files and I was wondering, > what is the best archive utility to use on these files? With the VEF files you can use either AR or LZH and get good compression. Don't bother with the GIF files.. they're compressed darn tight in that GIF format. Have fun archiving . -- John - < Posted with Ved 2.3.1 & IX 1.2.0 > -*- 88707 19-JUL 03:26 General Information RE: GIF/VEF (Re: Msg 88695) From: JEVESTAL To: REVWCP > I am in the process of doing some housekeeping on my harddrive. I have > a large amount of VEF and GIF files and I was wondering, what is the > best archive utility to use on these files? Which, AR...LZH..., etc. > will create the smallest file? Most GIFs are compressed by nature so any compression program will just store them. Most VEFs though are not compressed and I would suspect that LHA (much better than LZH) will compress them the tightest. That is... until we get a Zip on the CoCo... I use Zip (or is it gzip) on my Unix account and it compresses mail messages about 75% (25% of previous size). This is much better than 13 bit compress or even lha. Good luck. Jim ======================== InfoXpress 01.01.00 OS-9/6809 ====================== | Narnia BBS: 11pm-7am PDT serving CoCo OS-9 users ----|---- StG network: sysop@Narnia "Exclusively OS-9" | Delphi: JEVestal@delphi.com Marysville, CA InterNet: JEVestal@narnia.wa.com | or : JEVestal@citrus.sac.ca.us (916) 743-2617 Voice: 7am-11pm PDT :1 Corinthians 1:18 & Romans 1:16 ============================================================================= Jim Vestal: Assistant editor of The International OS-9 Underground, "Magazine dedicated to OS-9/OSK Users Everywhere -*- 88708 19-JUL 07:26 General Information RE: GIF/VEF (Re: Msg 88695) From: JEJONES To: REVWCP > I have a large amount of VEF and GIF files and I was wondering, what > is the best archive utility to use on these files? Which, AR...LZH..., > etc. will create the smallest file? Brother Jeremy, VEF files come in a couple of flavors, original and extra crispy--er, run length encoded. Either AR or LZH should do quite well with the original, and tolerably well with the run length encoded. GIF files, on the other hand, are already 12-bit LZW compressed--that's why it takes so long to display them, you have to uncompress the data as well as displaying it. For that reason, you're unlikely to get much in the way of compression out of GIF files. (BTW, this past Saturday I had my first neume reading experience. My skills definitely need work.) Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- End of Thread. -*- 88697 18-JUL 03:45 General Information RE: Sony Service Anecdote (Re: Msg 88160) From: JMOORFOOT To: MARTYGOODMAN TYMNET is not an option for me. I am connecting from Australia, & an Internet connection is free (through work) but an X.25 connection costs an arm & a leg. John -*- 88706 19-JUL 02:29 General Information Press Release From: JOELHEGBERG To: ALL * Joint Press Release: Sub-Etha Software and Blackhawk Enterprises * * July, 1994 * Sub-Etha Software and Blackhawk Enterprises are pleased to announce additional free software being included with all new MM/1 computer systems. Sub-Etha's flexible CheckBook+ program will now be included with all new MM/1 computer systems. CheckBook+ is an advanced checkbook balancing program to help out with your finances. Made popular on the Color Computer, CheckBook+ can not only balance your checkbook, but also help you visualize it with many different types of graphs. Search and sort your checkbook database easily, on any field! Joel Mathew Hegberg has written several public domain programs for the MM/1 computer system, which are available on many information services. Now, he has compiled a collection of his most popular public domain software into a new disk called "Joel Mathew Hegberg's MM/1 P.D. Anthology Diskette," which will be included with all new MM/1 computer systems. Programs which will let you: play popular MOD song files, display a graphical clock, play games, vocally announce the time, display VEF picture files, several screen savers, and much more! Sub-Etha Software's immensely popular MiniBanners multi-line banner program will also now come standard with all new MM/1 systems. With over 30 fonts included, MiniBanners allows you to create exotic text banners on ANY printer you may own. We even include a font preview program for MiniBanners' fonts. BlackHawk Enterprises and Sub-Etha Software are pleased to make this software available to new MM/1 owners to help them get started with their computer right away. Existing MM/1 owners who wish to obtain Joel's P.D. Anthology may obtain it through BlackHawk Enterprises for a $12.50 media/copying/shipping fee. Existing MM/1 owners who wish to obtain CheckBook+ or MiniBanners for K-Windows may obtain it through Sub-Etha Software for $12.50 ($10.00 media/copying + $2.50 S&H). Addresses are listed below. Sincerely, Allen C. Huffman, Sub-Etha Software Joel Mathew Hegberg, Sub-Etha Software David Graham, BlackHawk Enterprises ------------------------------------------------ BlackHawk Enterprises P.O. Box 10552 Enid, OK. 73706 (405) 234-2347 Sub-Etha Software OSK/Midwest Division 936 North Twelfth Street DeKalb, IL. 60115-2516 (815) 748-6638 -*- 88711 19-JUL 16:12 General Information Review of Microsoft Windows 4.0 From: MARTYGOODMAN To: ALL - -------------------forwards removed-------------------- *** REVIEW: - AMAZING WINDOWS 4.0 *** We are privileged this month to bring you our long overdue article on Microsoft's groundbreaking Operating System, the incredible Windows 4.0. Our exceptional journalistic standards demand that we preface this article by a restatement of our policy concerning review of non-shipping products. While our policy has always been that we would review no product that is not actually shipping at the time of publication, WE HAVE CHANGED OUR POLICY FOR THIS ISSUE ONLY. Our policy for this issue is that we will review any product that someone tells us might possibly be developed at any time in the future. After this issue, our policy will revert to what it was prior to this issue until such time that Microsoft begins to again consider their next edition of software and begins another high-visibility promotion geared to discourage users from looking at the competition. We put the wonderful Windows 4.0 operating system through our grueling bench benchmark program which was magnanimously donated to PC Labs by Microsoft Corporation. Our test bed was the standard by platform used most PC users--a Cray Supercomputer with 3 Gigabytes of RAM and a $9000 Windows graphics accelerator card with 512 Megabytes of SRAM. Our testing was made more difficult by the fact that no actual code was available at the time of the procedure. We did have available, however, a screen shot of the stupendous Windows 4.0 which we put through its paces. Our staff was speechless over how pretty the screen shot was. We also had the benefit of the assistance of 12 Microsoft employees who provided invaluable input, and also took us to lunch as well as provide us all with free copies of MicroSoft Office. The tremendous Windows 4.0 was a dream to install. We didn't even have to open the box! All of our applications were immediately migrated into the new OS, except the OS/2 applications. They mysteriously disappeared. We were told that this is a bug in the way that OS/2 apps are written and that this was IBM's problem. The screen shot scored a respectable .000001 Winmarks on our testing platform. Microsoft officials assure us that performance of the actual code promises to be even better. The only compatibility problem arose when OS/2 for Windows stubbornly refused to load the screen shot. Microsoft officials advise us that this was also IBM's problem. Microsoft officials told us that 4 Megabytes of RAM minimum would be needed in the release version. However, they also said that they would recommend 32 Megabytes for typical usage. Microsoft officials said, and we agree, that all serious PC users will have 32 Megabytes of RAM on their systems by the time Win 4.0 is released. Windows 4.0 is too sophisticated an OS for those that refuse to keep up. We were at first concerned with the reports of the apparent absence of 32-bit code contained in Windows 4.0. However, the Microsoft officials soon set us straight. Due to Microsoft still having the patent pending for the new technology, MS officials couldn't tell us how it worked, but told us of a new Microsoft compression technology. It turns out that all of the apparent 16-bit code present in Win 4.0 is actually 32-bit bit code that has been compressed by Microsoft to look like it is only 16 bits. Microsoft officials say that this is the wave of the future in 32-bit computing. In order for you to take advantage of the power of Win 4.0, Microsoft will be releasing three new products. These products are Visual COBOL,Visual Assembler and Visual Machine Language. The Microsoft representatives gave us a sneak peak of the Visual Machine Language product. Visual Machine Language will contain the famous Microsoft App Wizard. At first the App Wizard looked like it was only generating huge random streams of ones and zeros. However, one representative assured us that this was not the case and that MS had used it to write most of the Windows NT code. In summary, we can state without any fear of being accused of hyperbole that the most excellent Windows 4.0 is the greatest technological breakthrough since the discovery of fire and the invention of the wheel (neither of which, unfortunately, is patented by Microsoft..... yet). The God-like Windows 4.0 ranks right up there with the other accomplishments of Microsoft, such as the graphical user interface,the mouse, memory management and on-the-fly disk compression. It is at this point that we should state PC Magazine's new policy with regard to software patents, viz., We feel strongly that any software patent not held by Microsoft is void and bad for the industry. There will be a plethora of applications specifically written to take advantage of the astounding Windows 4.0. All major software developers are expected to begin work on products immediately after reading this article. Versions of WordPerfect and Lemmings for Win 4.0 should be shipping by the time you read this. If you cannot wait for your copy of the sexy Windows 4.0, we suggest you immediately go out and buy a copy of the highly innovative MS-DOS 6.2. Follow that up with several copies of the award winning Windows for Workgroups 3.11. If you are still impatient, buy the long awaited Windows NT, which is available in bulk quantity from your local retailer at huge discounts. By that time, if the most esteemed Windows 4.0 is still not shipping, buy a few more copies of Windows NT. While we usually don't give awards to products that are not even in Alpha release, we feel that we have no choice but to award our prestigious ZIFF-DAVIS Editor's Choice to the awesome Microsoft Windows 4.0. And even though it is only July, we have also given it our ZIFF-DAVIS Year-End Technical Excellence Award in ALL categories for the years 1994 through 1999. We expect an even better version of Windows in the year 2000. So, what are you waiting for? *Note: All words (except "fire" and "wheel") and all alphanumeric characters in this article are registered trademarks of Microsoft. - ----- End Included Message ----- -*- 88717 20-JUL 03:48 General Information RE: Review of Microsoft Windows 4.0 *Note: All words (except "fire" and "wheel") and all alphanumeric > characters in > this article are registered trademarks of Microsoft. Thank you so much for passing this along... I've not found something this funny in a very long time! ;) ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88730 20-JUL 21:35 General Information RE: Review of Microsoft Windows 4.0 Chris BTW, I resolderd the fly-back transformer connections on my Maggie-Monitor (they all looked really bad!!!) and haven't had a problem in 3 weeks! THANKS!!!!!! :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> :-> Chris "HAWKSoft" <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: <-: Delphi: HAWKSOFT Internet: HAWKSOFT@DELPHI.COM ******************< Uploaded w/ InfoXpress vr. 1.01.00 >****************** -*- 88749 22-JUL 12:54 General Information RE: Review of Microsoft Windows 4.0 comes to Cocoing. I only discovered Delphi about a year ago. Until then, I > was pretty clueless about OS/9. Isn't Delphi amazing? I don't know what I'd do if I wasn't "connected" to the outside world. I also didn't know what I was missing until I got onto Delphi. > Now I have encountered the so called BLOB. > It seems to be a subject that makes forum members weary. I don't have much experience with this, but I know it seemed to be a very technical problem that people could not seem to agree on what the cause was. I heard discussions on memory swap timing problems, byte-alignment stuff, etc. Whatever the cause, BLOB stands for Boot List Order Bug, so try changing the order of your boot modules until you get something that works. I only once had a BLOB problem (before I moved to MM/1 OS-9/68000), and I just rearranged things until they were working. I believe Eddie Kuns uploaded a possible BLOB fix to the database here, so you may want to do a search for BLOB there. > If you caught Mark Griffith's message on the Cocolist, you know that > some users are hanging it up, hopefully not because of people like me. Nah, I don't think anyone would leave OS-9 because someone asked for help learning OS-9. That's what we love to see! The reason why Mark is leaving is lack of professional applications and, what he views, as no potential for OS-9 in the personal computer market. I'm unsure about OS-9's personal computer future, but I know it works great for me on my personal computer, and I haven't found an OS that I'd rather use (and I've used LOTS of them). You choose what's best for you. I believe Boisy posted some excellent points in his recent message as to why OS-9 truly is a fantastic OS for personal computers. > or should I go the way of Mark Griffith? I love my Coco I hope you don't choose Mark's path, for the reason you stated above... "I love my CoCo". Don't give up the things you love. > but when I > pushed a bit further, I created the BLOB. When my system is running OK, I > marvel at what OS-9 and my Coco can do. When I screw it up badly trying to > add yet another capability I start to feel guilty begging for help here on > the forum. Hey, if I felt guilty about asking for on-line help here, I would really be in bad shape. There are no stupid questions. Sometimes I may feel a little dumb after asking a question I realize I knew the answer to, or found in my manual the next day, but people are always happy to help I've found. And besides, you're not "begging for help", rather you're "asking for assistance". > To sum it up, I feel kind of bad because I take without ever giving > much other than some loyalty to the OS-9 community. That's something OS-9 desperately needs... I'm glad you've found an OS you can be loyal to. I did. ============================================================================= Joel Mathew Hegberg M.O.T.D. Editor (JoelHegberg@delphi.com) 68'micros Columnist Sub-Etha Software Programmer ============================================================================= -*- 88735 21-JUL 00:23 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88729) From: MITHELEN To: JOELHEGBERG General concensus seems to be that, cc3disk tends to be semi position dependant and that only 1 in ever 4 byte positions will produce a truely stable floppy access. 2 of the positions will usually work, but may be flakey, and the last position will mostlikely give the "BLOB". The typical fix to a BLOBed boot is to add 1-3 bytes (I usually just add 2, since that has always worked) to the end of a module that is before cc3disk in the boot file (usually init). This can be done with the "xtend" command within EZgen (which people with a Burke^2 hard disk setup should already have) Or, use DeD to "diddle" the length of init before os9gen'ing a new boot disk... -- Paul -*- 88736 21-JUL 00:30 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88729) From: MROWEN01 To: JOELHEGBERG Thanks for your feedback Joel! I7ve already gotten a few mail responses with some help. The BLOB has always been referenced to but never fully explained. I guess I can understand why now. I'm working with some very sizable manuscript stuff right now. I'm using ved and vprint. Would you recommend this same set of tools under OSK or is there something more elaborate under OSK? Again thanks for taking the time to respond. I guess Mark's message made me think about what I'm doing with OS-9. I'm trying to patch things to the point where I can do document processing, read/write PCDOS files, and support an additional user who is terminal connected. One of my first problems was finding an editor for use on a terminal. Finding none, I have been writing one with BASIC09. IT's half done. I started in C but have some learning to do yet. Do you know of a terminal editor anywhere? I expected to see something VT100 capable, but the search has been fruitless so far. I didn't even see UNIX C code that I could adapt. Delphi is amazing. -Mike -*- 88739 21-JUL 02:29 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88719) From: COCOKIWI To: MROWEN01 The "BLOB" has been around a while and driven a lot of people to #$%^ a lot! The RBF file MUST be within one block...The CC3Disk and others also... there is a electronic fix also which fixes the Timming problem,I have not had a BLOB problem since! the Electronic fix strangly enough is VERY much the same as the OLD org fix for the ORG 64k computer...back then 64k was a do it yourself add on,the problem was the ROM was getting into the 64k memory causing problems! the fix was a Gate clocking the Rom select chip! The FIX for the CoCo-3 is basicly the same! S1 to gate....E to gate Gate to pin 5pin has to be cut and bent up...The 74ls02 can be hung on top of the 74ls138.......I think there is a file on it in the Database! Timming fix!........I did this fix to mine! and I use a HD6309E instead of the MC6809E...... Dennis -*- 88741 21-JUL 21:12 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88736) From: JEJONES To: MROWEN01 > I'm working with some very > sizable manuscript stuff right now. I'm using ved and vprint. Would you > recommend this same set of tools under OSK or is there something more > elaborate under OSK? There are several things more elaborate under OSK: one would be TeX and LaTeX; another would be Lout and either a PostScript printer or GhostScript. BUT...that doesn't necessarily mean that I wouldn't recommend ved and vprint under OSK! The OSK versions are even better than the 6809 versions, and the kved front end for ved makes it very easy to use. (Note that I'm not associated with Bob van der Poel save as a satisfied customer.) Opinions herein are solely those of their respective authors. Clipper Chip: Big Brother Inside -*- 88745 21-JUL 23:02 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88729) From: REVWCP To: JOELHEGBERG Dear Joel: One of the most enjoyable parts of OS-9 for me has been the willingness of people to be willing to answer questions. Goodness, if asking stupid questions was a crime, I would be Public Enemy #1....I have said this many times, there is a wonderful spirit of cooperation here. People who I have met on-line have become very dear friends to me. I would think that even if the day came when I would move on to another system, as long as there is this Forum, I would still stop in to say hello. You know, there are so many special moments for me as I look back over these past 7 or 8 years. Getting started...going on-line...the Fests...my humble offerings to the group...our special time of fellowship on Sunday morning...I can't put a price on this. The technical knowledge I have gained is worth a Degree, but the intangible things far go beyond that. I guess, I'm in it for the duration. With all best wishes, Brother Jeremy, CSJW OS9 User's Group Treasurer -*- 88746 22-JUL 00:16 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88741) From: MROWEN01 To: JEJONES Thanks. That's good to know. I'm putting my wish list together and I've started to save the buck$ to buy an OSK system. What OSK system do you have? -Mike -*- 88747 22-JUL 00:35 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88736) From: KSCALES To: MROWEN01 Hi, Mike - > I'm working with some very > sizable manuscript stuff right now. I'm using ved and vprint. Would you > recommend this same set of tools under OSK or is there something more > elaborate under OSK? Well, yes, there is something more powerful under OSK -- called Ved and Vprint . You'd feel right at home -- but have a built-in spellchecker, multiple edit buffers, column operations and a myriad of other enhancements. Bob seems to add a new feature to Ved every 2 weeks... > Do you know of a terminal editor anywhere? I expected to see something > VT100 capable, but the search has been fruitless so far. A good choice for that would be DynaStar, which was my mainstay for editing under both Level 1 and Level 2. Regards... / Ken -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken Scales Delphi:KSCALES Internet:kscales@delphi.com CIS:74646,2237 =-=-=-=-=-= Intel: Putting the backward in backward compatible =-=-=-=-=-= -*- 88751 22-JUL 15:20 General Information RE: OS-9 Patches for the Coco III (Re: Msg 88747) From: MROWEN01 To: KSCALES (NR) So Dynastar will run on a terminal. Is this widely available? Where might I aquire this package for Level II? -Mike -*- End of Thread. -*- 88721 20-JUL 20:02 General Information RE: Crashed Coco3 (Re: Msg 88122) From: NEALSTEWARD To: COCOKIWI Haven't been on in awhile, so if you remember the message thread, I was wondering if you would have any idea why a bad connector would appear when the system WAS working fine? -*- 88722 20-JUL 20:03 General Information RE: Crashed Coco3 (Re: Msg 88173) From: NEALSTEWARD To: TEDJAEGER I bought the SCII from Joe Scinta of Ken-Ton. I think the only "incompatiblity" is addresses, which this one uses an alternate address. Besides the system WAS working fine for quite some time. -*- 88723 20-JUL 20:06 General Information RE: Crashed Coco3 (Re: Msg 88224) From: NEALSTEWARD To: RICKMAC (NR) Tried all those ideas already. It is working now, but it might not if I were to reboot later tonight. It has been real humid lately, but the problem began before the hot weather too. I understand the "buggy" feeling! -*- 88738 21-JUL 02:12 General Information RE: Crashed Coco3 (Re: Msg 88721) From: COCOKIWI To: NEALSTEWARD (NR) contacts!!!!! they oxidize over time forming a resistance between the connector and the socket,GOLD plated contacts AND gold plated connectors last longer between plugging,s....... Dennis......P.S........get a good contact cleaner! -*- End of Thread. -*- 88725 20-JUL 20:28 Applications (6809) RE: SOFTWARE (Re: Msg 88217) From: NEALSTEWARD To: MORRISA (NR) I don't recommend Color Artist at all. I bought it and found it useless, there are better graphic editors available, even Max9, a shareware editor is more powerful. If you still want it thought, you can HAVE it for a couple bucks shipping. -*- 88726 20-JUL 20:37 General Information RE: Drives (Re: Msg 88308) From: NEALSTEWARD To: REVWCP I run a 3.5" 80 track drive as /d1 and here is my dmode output: adr=$FF40 drv=$01 stp=$03 typ=$20 dns=$03 cyl=$0050 sid=$02 vfy=$00 sct=$0012 tos=$0012 ilv=$03 sas=$08 Hope this is of some help. -*- 88733 20-JUL 22:34 General Information RE: Drives (Re: Msg 88726) From: REVWCP To: NEALSTEWARD (NR) Dear Neal: ilv=is $02, I will have to play with this. Thank you for your response. With all best wishes, Brother Jeremy, CSJW OS9 User's Group Treasurer -*- End of Thread. -*- 88727 20-JUL 20:41 General Information RE: Bill's Book? (Re: Msg 88461) From: NEALSTEWARD To: MRUPGRADE You and a few hundred others are looking for that book. As I understand it, it was advertized, orders send, but never delivered. -*- FORUM>Reply, Add, Read, "?" or Exit> No more messages. FORUM>Reply, Add, Read, "?" or Exit>